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Thread: Dual STI build log

  1. #501
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    Thanks for the update on what they look for.
    Starfox

  2. #502
    Senior Member jrevens's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    Wow, that sounds pretty ridiculous to me. Seems like he should go get some real world experience with homebuilts, then come back & reapply for that job. Unless he can show that the way the brake lines were run is a safety of flight issue, he’s off base. The safety wire issue is something he could have mentioned as good practice and then, at the very most, suggest you correct it, and sign it off. It’s a shame... sorry to hear it.
    John Evens
    Arvada, CO
    Kitfox SS7 N27JE
    EAA Lifetime
    Chap. 43 honorary Lifetime

  3. #503
    Senior Member Delta Whisky's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    Sorry to hear the bad news . . . . . sounds as if you (maybe he) was caught between the proverbial rock and hard spot. Was his supervisor one of the attendees? If not, maybe a conversation with him would save you from re-routing the brake line to a less than favorable position. By your description, it sounds like you routed the way most of us with the cabane gear did - I sure don't want to change mine.

  4. #504
    Senior Member efwd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    That really stinks. If you haven't painted the Oratex underneath yet I would say It will be no problem. So, It seams the DAR believes while building an Experimental you must follow the build manual. I don't believe rerouting Brake lines would be a significant enough alteration/modification to justify putting the plane back into phase 1 after you finish your 40hrs. Rather than address it with the FSDO I would route these his way then when your phase 1 is finished and you still find it undesirable change it back. Unpainted Oratex will patch so easily.
    Eddie Forward
    Flying
    SS7, 912iS, Garmin G3X

  5. #505
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    Unfortunately the DAR for Utah lives in Idaho, so he charged 900$ because of travel time. The other option was we could of waited for the FAA which they said is over a year wait right now. We where worried we are going to have to pay to have him come out but he got approval from the fsdo to approve via photos so that is good news! Cory got him to agree to a solution to over drill the hole and place a grommet in the hole and keep it in the same location. Also good news, but a pain to have to remove brake lines and re-bleed the brake system. Was kind of perfect storm because I think he was nervous with the FAA there so he was calling him on things that he usually probably wouldn't. Defiantly a pain having the FAA present. Cory was saying how funny it was that they new little about a Rotax. They asked him that he needs to start the engine and run it. They all backed up to the road, because its in Cory's driveway. They all had their hands over their ears thinking its going to be loud. They also told him he has to show them the throttle would manipulate the engine so he is going to have to power it up. They kept on calling the engine a 914. We didn't mention that the 912 has been slightly modified. After the run, they where amazed at how quiet and smooth running that engine is. (Thanks Edge EFI) The one FAA guy said "that engine is incredibly smooth and I cant believe how fast it started. Did you see the prop stop when he shut it down." They also could not figure out why he did not have a mixture control, and how he is going to control mixture. Cory told them its EFI and they where like "huh"? I have learned that on your final inspection is like a checkride. Only provide enough info to satisfy the question. Do not give anymore info. They seemed to be concerned that we had hired someone to build it. The FAA kept asking who painted it. Cory said "no one." Then they asked did you paint it? Cory said "no" "Who painted it silver then and put the stripe on it", they asked? Cory told them, "that is oratex and that is how it comes." He said they looked at each other like they have no idea what he just said. Then they asked so you painted the stripe then? Cory was like, "no that's a vinyl sticker." .......well.....moving on

    Cory is working on getting the brake lines in compliance and photos off to the DAR. He then said he can mail the airworthiness and from there we will move it to the airport. Overall I don't want to paint the picture poorly on the DAR, but I think we just had bad luck with the DAR just getting hired and FAA present. Good news is the FAA guy that came also issues the repairmen so he told Cory all he needs to do is come up to the office and he will give him the repairmen license because he has seen the plane.
    Dustin Dickerson

    Building 7ss STI x 2
    Oratex
    29" shock monster
    EP912STI 155hp
    Garmin
    N33TF......FLYING!
    N53TF......FLYING!

  6. #506
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    Several times during my career, I had sim checks with a new check airman and the FAA there to check him out. To say those rides were not fun is an understatement. Nitpicking to the max. Hopefully in the future the guy will be a little more relaxed and get to know homebuilt aircraft better. Good luck on your AW.

    Rick

  7. #507
    Senior Member colospace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    Wow, I thought I had to jump thru extra hoops! There were three DARs presumably available in my area. One DAR was not recommended by one of my friends as the DAR was known to only do a cursory inspection. The second DAR has a good reputation, but lives farther away. I went with option three based upon some fairly favorable third hand input and his proximity to my airport. This DAR had some some experimental aircraft before, but admitted several times that he more frequently dealt with Airbuses. He spent 3 1/2 hours looking over the airplane and paperwork and ultimately only questioned the service loop I have in my Pitot/AOA lines at the probe. I explained my reason for doing it that way and he eventually got okay with it.
    Most of my frustration and extra effort involved things that are not actually required for EAB aircraft (as confirmed by my talking with the EAA).
    He wanted a POH (which I had a good start on) with actual performance numbers, even if they were only best guesses, and to understand the basis from which I got my numbers. I extracted what I could from the generic book that Kitfox sells. He obviously spent time looking over my POH as we did several email exchanges of my drafts.
    He also expected that I perform a taxi test. I had not planned to do that until after sign-off and had some concern relative to insurance if something were to happen before the plane had been signed off. I wanted to keep moving forward and just get the sign-off done, so I did some taxiing to do some initial brake bedding.
    In the end, it seems he did a thorough inspection that I hoped for and was easy to work with, but I certainly did not anticipate the extras "required". I asked about the Repairman's Certificate too, but he indicated he could not do that and I would need to go to the FSDO. Of course COVID19 has suspended any effort there.
    Glad to hear that you appear to have a path forward, but I feel your pain.

    Looks like I need to update my sig as the building (initial at least) is DONE!
    - Gary
    S7 SuperSport Tri-gear
    w/Rotax 912, Oratex, Dynon

  8. #508
    Senior Member aviator79's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    What a huge disappointment. I'll agree with the others here that these things sound like they could have been suggestions of good practice. Of course, you should bent the safetywire in, but that is not an airworthiness issue.

    My DAR brought a fed to do a periodic proficiency check. I was worried when I found out the fed was coming. As it turned out, both the DAR and the Fed were courteous, professional, and friendly. They did two planes in about three hours, gave us each a few pointers and suggestions, and then posed for pictures while handing over our certificates. It's also frustrating that it's a year wait to get a Fed to look at your plane, but they can spare two to evaluate the DAR?

    In the end: minor speedbump. It sounds like you'll be able to get it squared away pretty easily and flying shortly.
    --Brian
    Flying - S7SS

  9. #509
    Senior Member efwd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    This all sounds terrible. Im grateful that my DAR was also my EAA technical counselor and had visited three times through the build. He was fairly familiar with a Kitfox by time he did the final inspection.
    Eddie Forward
    Flying
    SS7, 912iS, Garmin G3X

  10. #510
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    Default Re: Dual STI build log

    Yeah i guess it could be worse. We will get it sorted and down to the airport shortly. Having a FAA rep is usually not a good thing including check rides!
    Dustin Dickerson

    Building 7ss STI x 2
    Oratex
    29" shock monster
    EP912STI 155hp
    Garmin
    N33TF......FLYING!
    N53TF......FLYING!

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