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Thread: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

  1. #1

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    Default Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    Hello,
    I’m new to flying and in the market for a kitfox but would like to know the difference between the model 4 and the model 5? I’ve seen a lot of model 4’s for sale and not so many 5’s. What research I’ve done looks like they are really close?
    Thanks

  2. #2
    Senior Member PapuaPilot's Avatar
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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    The short reply is that the model 5, 6 and 7 are all very similar, and different than the model 4. The later models have a larger fuselage, higher gross weight and was made to use larger engines than the model 1-4.

    The link for history is no longer working at the Kitfox website.
    Phil Nelson
    A&P-IA, Maintenance Instructor
    KF 5 Outback, Cont. IO-240
    Flying since 2016

  3. #3

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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    Thank you for the information

  4. #4

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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    You need to go sit in a 4, and then a 5,6,or 7.
    There is quite a bit of difference in cabin size and other things as well.
    Best to see it for yourself.
    Good luck.
    Kitfox 5 Vixon
    Flying

  5. #5
    Senior Member Slyfox's Avatar
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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    Quote Originally Posted by PapuaPilot View Post
    The short reply is that the model 5, 6 and 7 are all very similar, and different than the model 4. The later models have a larger fuselage, higher gross weight and was made to use larger engines than the model 1-4.

    The link for history is no longer working at the Kitfox website.
    wow! I think I'm offended. I have a 4. I love it. It feels very personal to me. meaning it fits me. I have one of those big engines. yup the 912uls the same one that is standard for the model 7. Now I play big time with my plane, I have big tires. I feel the advantage of the 5 thru 7 is it's for the big person. yup, I'm a small guy 5'6 or there abouts and 175. so I fit perfect in the 4. It's like the 2000 Silverado, my truck, fits me real nice. I get in the newer chevy's and they seem so big. they are made for the BIG guy. sure I can drive them, but I love the feel of mine. same with the kitfox's the higher number fox's are bigger. more robust. have a higher payload. I guess you can go for whatever you want, but if you fit in a 4, that's a plane to have. it can give you some fun factor. just my 2 cents worth.
    steve
    slyfox
    model IV 1200-flying
    912uls
    IVO medium in-flight
    RV7A-flying
    IO-360
    constant speed prop

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    This is a link to a page with pretty detailed...well details...about the various models (see below). I have the model 4-1200, and you can get them cheaper because they made so many kits, and some folks sell them off to upgrade to the more utility capable models 5,6 and 7. However, the model 4 is by far the most bang for the buck, best combination of useful features, ability to use a smaller cheaper engine and still go fairly fast, and of course lower overall cost to buy, and often maintain too..But watch out, some model 4s had a 1050 gross, and those should not sell for much more than a model 2 or 3.

    http://kitfox.lazair.com/skystar/Aircraft_History.htm

    Hope this helps
    Roger

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    My personal opinion is that the Model 4/1200 in in a class by itself. Outward appearance is similar to the Models 1 thru 3 but otherwise it's a totally different airplane. The controls are different, they fly different and they perform better. The 4 has a totally different airfoil than the earlier models. The vertical is much larger and the control rigging is much improved. The Model 4 with an equal Rotax 912 will outperform the 5 thru 7's in about every area. The Models 5 thru 7 moves the engine forward so heavier engines work better on these than the model 4. They also can carry much more weight in the baggage area without getting into an aft CG problem. Kitfox made a giant leap forward with the Model 4/1200. The 5 thru 7 are more refined. All are good. I love my 4 with 912, Grove gear and fat tires. I'm sure I'd be equally happy with a later model. You can't go wrong with either.

  8. #8

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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    I really appreciate all the feedback. I’ve found a model 4 that I really like and plan to take a better look at it. Thanks again it was very helpful.

  9. #9
    Senior Member av8rps's Avatar
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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    The Model 5 though 7 are really great airplanes, and because of their slightly increased cabin size, baggage area, and strengthening allowing for a 29% gross weight increase, that all makes for a pretty versatile airplane for the average guy.

    But those nice improvements increase the average empty weight about 25%. And considering that the newer Kitfoxes and the model 4 use the same wing and tail, performance is going to be less on the newer models with the same power as the wing and engine has to haul more weight. Unless you are willing to go all out and spend the big $$ on a 915is and a STI wing, the Model 4 with a 100 hp Rotax is going to outperform the newer models pretty significantly. I would speculate that a 912ULS powered 4 with a standard wing will perform on par with that 915 powered Model 7 STI, but that is speculation because I have never flown a 915is STI. The 4 for sure would be faster in cruise.

    Now I'm not knocking the new Kitfoxes, as I personally really like them and have many times contemplated upgrading. But I fit in my Model 4 really well (at 6 ft 1" and 190 lbs), and even with only a 80 hp 912ul and a 250 lb set of amphibs hanging underneath it, it still performs great. And of course, I have significantly less money in it than I would have to pay for a newer model.

    And yes, you can typically buy a Model 4 for much less than a Model 5, 6, or 7. That doesn't mean the 4 is that much less of an airplane. The price difference is more reflected in what the original builder spent building it back in the early 90's as opposed to what it costs today (eg, a new 912 was under 10 grand back in the early 90's and the kit was 12 grand). So back in the 90's you could put together a nice Model 4 for 25 to 30 grand. Today, a Model 7 SS will cost 65 to 75 grand. That really is the primary reason why there is such a price difference. It isn't that the 4 is half the airplane. In fact, I would say the 4 is 90 percent of what the new ones are in overall usefulness, and 125% in performance.

    But again, they are all great airplanes. The cool thing with the Kitfox design is whatever your taste and budget, you can have it your way.

    You can't go wrong with any Kitfox in my opinion...

  10. #10
    Senior Member HighWing's Avatar
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    Default Re: Classic Model 4 1200 vs Model 5

    Quote Originally Posted by av8rps View Post

    Now I'm not knocking the new Kitfoxes, as I personally really like them and have many times contemplated upgrading. But I fit in my Model 4 really well (at 6 ft 1" and 190 lbs), and even with only a 80 hp 912ul .... it still performs great. And of course, I have significantly less money in it than I would have to pay for a newer model.

    ..
    I couldn't agree more. Early on when home building was a bit more of a novelty, I used to say my Kitfox is more like a dirt bike than a Honda Goldwing. I fit in everything "medium" and the IV fits "me" perfectly. As far as "luggage" I was often curious when on our group fly-outs seeing what some guys brought to camp in. My tent weighed 7 lbs. Sleeping bag - 1.5 lbs and packed into a compression sack the size of a football. Personal items were in a modestly sized backpack and strapped in the passenger seat. Due to some mods, my baggage sack was placarded at 25 lbs. and never maxed out. Paul was spot on when he mentioned cost. 1993 $9000 including speedster elevator - trim tab - option. 912 UL - $11,000. Panel and paint close to another "10", Then I did it again ten years later for about the same $$.

    Other's thoughts may vary!
    Lowell Fitt
    Goodyear, AZ


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