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Thread: EFWD Build

  1. #721
    Senior Member efwd's Avatar
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    How do you get your mitts on so many different KFs? This has to be the 3rd or 4th I have seen you flying.
    Eddie Forward
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    SS7, 912iS, Garmin G3X

  2. #722
    Administrator DesertFox4's Avatar
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    I lost count at around 30 different Kitfoxs Eddie. That’s why my Kitfox grin is now permanent.


    DesertFox4
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  3. #723
    Senior Member efwd's Avatar
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    OK. just got off the phone with Garmin Support. I was told it is recommended that I use a GPS antenna for at least one of my two G3X screens. I was sold one Antenna to operate my Transponders internal WAAS GPS. I was told that would serve all my needs. Is anyone using two GPS antennas to cover the G3X as well as the transponders WAAS? In my case, a GTX345. I am having a bit of trouble getting my transponder to work. I have a 1090es error for whatever thats worth. The manual tells me to do a software update and you have to be a dealer to download it. Looks like I get to go back to the avionics shop.
    Eddie Forward
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    SS7, 912iS, Garmin G3X

  4. #724
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    Not knowing either the Garmin way of doing things or your individual setup, I will now attempt to confuse you even more by adding unsubstantiated guesswork

    The 1090 ES is the transponder's extended squitter (not guesswork). This is used to transmit the extra data necessary for ADSB OUT from your transponder and, for this, your transponder would need a GPS position. Is this the way you've set up your system or do you have a completely separate ADSB unit?

    Assuming you have got it set up this way it sounds to me as if you're not getting a decent transponder GPS fix (guesswork). If it were me I would wheel the aircraft outside and let it sit there for a while. The first GPS fix can often take quite some time while the kit figures out where it is and resets its almanac. I'm sure you've shut down a GPS unit before, taken it somewhere else and then had to wait longer than usual for it to work out its position. This is the same thing and is definitely not helped if your aircraft is in a hangar with a metal roof. Also, just make sure of the location of your GPS antenna. Is it up the right way and not underneath carbon fibre?

    As far as needing more than one GPS I am going to assume you have the transponder connected through the CAN bus to the rest of the system, including your EFIS. If this is the case I do not think you would need a separate GPS as the CAN bus will share the data from your transponder GPS (once it gets it.....see above). I'm actually going the other way with my MGL installation; I will share the EFIS GPS position with the transponder's extended squitter for ADSB OUT.

    Clearly, if your transponder is acting as a stand-alone device and is not connected to the CAN bus then there is no way the GPS data can be shared with your EFIS (assuming no NMEA connection either) and, therefore, you would need a GPS for your EFIS as well as the transponder

    You can get GPS splitters, rather like TV antenna splitters. I've heard good and bad things about them and, to be honest, it would be far cheaper and far easier just to buy another GPS antenna for the EFIS. So long as it is a powered antenna you don't need to spend mega bucks.

  5. #725
    Senior Member efwd's Avatar
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    I just spent 2 hours in the seat (didn't get a sore butt either) trying to go through the configuring. I think I have a can bus problem that I don't recall being there before I installed the boot cowl with sealer. The xpndr actually has its location I see on the screen. Puts me at the Chino Airport. Weirdness is, I see my location on the EFIS. If I go to the systems page of the EFIS the xpndr is the only thing not communicating. Thanks for the reply. I will keep you updated on the Gremlin hunt.
    Eddie Forward
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    SS7, 912iS, Garmin G3X

  6. #726
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    Well, that sounds like you've boiled it down a lot, Eddie:

    (1)You know your transponder GPS is receiving correctly and it is communicating your position to the transponder
    (2)You know the CAN bus between your transponder and EFIS must be good or else it wouldn't be showing your position on the EFIS (assuming the EFIS doesn't have another secret input )
    (3)You know the answer to your original question i.e. that you do not need another GPS connected to your EFIS to get your position (does it show your position on both screens?)

    My thinking is along the lines of:

    (1)You could have a snag with the transponder which is producing the 1090ES error message and, as Garmin have said, that may be cured by a software update. After curing that problem it may well then communicate correctly with your EFIS and show up on the systems page or

    (2)You have a communications error between the transponder and EFIS (on the CAN bus) which means that certain data is not being received by the transponder extended squitter e.g. baro altitude, which in turn chucks out the 1090 ES error. I would assume (read GUESS) the transponder has its own baro sensor if not connected to the an EFIS and receiving data that way. Perhaps disconnecting the transponder connection to the EFIS may force it to use that input and, possibly get rid of the ES error message. You almost certainly do not have to do this physically. Just go to the systems page and delete the transponder. See if it makes any difference and then just re-install the transponder. If it doesn't see the transponder when you try to re-install it you can virtually guarantee it is a CAN bus error and it's not communicating......then it's back to checking those pins and cursing the people who built that harness for you. It is strange, though, that you are receiving GPS data from the transponder but not, perhaps, sending some data to the transponder.

    Bit of chicken and egg going on whether it's (1) or (2) done first. I suppose if you're not going to be doing anything with the transponder for a little while then you could do (1) and at least it means you're all nice and up-to-date, whether it cures the snag or not. I would also lean that way given that position is being received from the transponder GPS, suggesting something in the CAN bus is working.

    The good thing is (3)

  7. #727
    Senior Member PapuaPilot's Avatar
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    I have a different G3X Touch setup With a GTX-23ES transponder (not the GTX345) and I added a GPS-20A WAAS GPS later to make the ADSB-Out work. I started with one GA-26 GPS antenna (small black type) hooked into the back of my screen. When I added the GPS-20A I needed the GA-35 antenna (bigger and white). I'm guessing you have a GA-35 antenna and it should be sufficient to provide GPS input for everything because the position data is sent to everything through the CAN bus.

    I'm not familiar with the GTX-345 installation, but it may be that it needs its own GPS antenna. What antenna are you using. Also, some of the Garmin components have an LED light that shows status and errors. If the GTX-345 has an LED can it tell you if it is getting CAN data. I seem to recall that a green LED means it is connected and working OK. Also, you should have a page with the setup screens that shows the status of every component hooked in your system. That page will have either a green check mark or red X. If your transponder isn't recognized than it will have the red X and that could point to a CAN bus problem.

    Happy troubleshooting, I hope you can solve the problems soon.

    If you need a separate antenna for your screen the less expensive ones work fine, but you have to have the WAAAS GA-35 antenna for the transponder me thinks.
    Phil Nelson
    A&P-IA, Maintenance Instructor
    KF 5 Outback, Cont. IO-240
    Flying since 2016

  8. #728
    Senior Member efwd's Avatar
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    I do have the GA-35 Phil. I forgot about the green LED, I will double check that. It was green at one time. I am in fact showing a red X in my systems screen for the transponder. When configuring my ADHARS Im supposed to see a GPS with a green check. That box is empty, no green check or red X. I feel this is going to be a CAN bus problem. I think that the fact that my location is presented on the EFIS is just that the EFIS has kept the last image it had before loss of GPS. After all, when I powered up the system the first time it showed me in Kansas.
    Eddie Forward
    Flying
    SS7, 912iS, Garmin G3X

  9. #729

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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    Had a similar problem the other day with adding a GPS2020 antenna on a Dynon 1000 Touch EFIS on a RV-12 to make it FAA 2020 year suitable for ADS B out.

    Update to most current version of software from Garmin with a memory stick.

    Install the new GPS antenna puck.

    Go in to set up and make sure the G3X is set up and talking with the new model antenna, you will have to select the model # of that antenna.


    After all of that, you have to go into setup instructions, and have your plane running with a magnetic cardinal settings for magnetic calibration to N, then E, then S, then West, with the engine running.

    That's the rough settings... then you go up in the air, and fly a clockwise 360 then a counterclockwise 360 to fine tune the magnetic compass settings. You might have to fly several set of 360's at various banking angles to get the best setup setting. You don NOT have to go to a Dynon dealership to get the software updates with monthly FAA updates and changed, it is provided free, and you can get them from Dynon's website. I don't know if this is possible with Garmin units, might require dealership visit. You probably need parallel inputs for both glass EFIS units from the one GPS antenna you installed. Ask Garmin if that is necessary, do you need to add a splitter.



    Other option is to call up Garmin and ask for technical support, so they can walk you through all you need to do, to get it up and running. Probably well worth it, to reduce the amount of headaches.

    Or go online to Garmin's website and see if they have a Bulletin Board that you can post up on to get help from others on your Garmin system and model. It's a Garmin system problem, per say, not a KitFox problem.
    Last edited by NinerBikes; 02-01-2019 at 11:08 AM.

  10. #730
    Senior Member efwd's Avatar
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    Default Re: EFWD Build

    I have found pictures of my EFIS that show the xpndr communicating so I have probably changed a setting that I should not have changed. I have Monday off so I will be at the plane on the phone with Garmin Support. They are very helpful.
    Eddie Forward
    Flying
    SS7, 912iS, Garmin G3X

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