Kitfox Yacht Tender/Built in Lifting Rings/ Best Model

[Dave S]

BM.

Regarding possible hard points for lifting at the rear of the aircraft - Kitfoxes have through tubes at the rear - get to a kitfox and it is pretty easy to see where they are - One short through tube at the front of the Vertical Stab has is designed to take the wing lock back bolt to secure the wings when they are folded - it's a pretty well reinforced point. Additionally, there are two longer through tubes at the bottom of the fuselage at the rear of the aircraft under the horizontal stabalizer - these are sometimes used for a tail dolly during building; or, a tail dolly when the wings are folded on a trigear (due to the lack of a tailwheel - my plane seems to lack a tailwheel to the chagrin of many of my peers) A trigear sits on it's butt with the wings folded too due to the CG shift with the wings folded)

OK - on the windscreen mods - where the rear spar bolts are located for the wing attach the windscreen (unless a builder has already made a modification) will be underneath the corner of the windscreen on the port & starboard corners - Again - find a kitfox and this will make make itself clear. On the front spar pins, there is normally a small aluminum cuff which goes over the area and over a portion of the windscreen at this position. Unlike the rear spar bolt location, during the build this corner must nave relief cuts around the pin under the cuff so the pins can be removed for wing folding - in all likelyhood, a person will need to provide a little more relief to accomodate the added hardware. You'll want to become familiar with cutting/working acrylic or polycarbonate (whichever the plane has for a windscreen) and become familiar with aircraft hardware as you will likely want a longer bolt for the rear spar location and replace the shear nut with a thicker standard aircraft castellated nut; and, on the front spar location, you will want to use aircraft bolts similar to the rear spar bolts with castle nuts rather than the pin secured with a hairpin (which is not designed to carry any load at all) used for keeping the pin in place.

Best bet is find a kitfox with an owner who will let you examine these points on the aircraft...plus you will end up doing some minor engineering with the hardware needed.

Cheers,

Dave S
KF 7 Trigear
912ULS Warp Drive
St Paul, MN

[Esser]

What ever Kitfox you decide, if you are on floats make sure it has loads of power. Personally If you want a good combination between solid and sporty I was say the Model 7 with the new STOL wing might be a good choice. More money than the 4 but it is bigger, hauls more, and can probably handle rougher water (That is just an assumption on my part)

HIABs are awesome so I dont think you have to worry about your crane!

I think I would lean towards trying to lift it on the boat with the wings out but if that's really not going to be practical I would say the suggestion to lift through that rear carry through is the best one. Kitfox is now putting handles on both sides of the 7 for moving it around. If your 7 had those two handles you could just run a sling under the handle, over the fuse, and then under the other handle with out much fuss. The whole rear fuselage is pretty sturdy.

Now for the question we've all wanted to ask....Where is the picture of your Yacht!

[jdmcbean]

First.. we are not putting handles on both sides. We did on the STi for another reason.

I would think the best way to lift with be with lift rings from the spar attach points.. However, if possible I would lift it with the wings out for CG reasons, place it on the deck then fold the wings. If that is not possible then using the wing tie-back location could be an option for an aft point.

[Tom Waid]

For short transits such as in the Bahamas or the Florida Keys, it could be easier to raft (tied to the side of the yacht with floats still in the water) the kitfox parallel to the hull of the boat with wings folded so the engine is better protected (rear of aircraft due to weight of the wings would raise the nose), though in addition to being secured over the wingbox, it would need lines fore and aft to ensure it does not try and twist against the hull. At this point, I'm thinking a bridle running from the front two float legs should secure the front of the aircraft and make sure the nose stays high.

All really interesting stuff and actually started to think this idea might not be as daft as it sounds!

Speaking as one who has quite a lot of time in yachts I think alongside towing of a float plane could be a disaster. Even a small chop can get both the yacht and airplane rolling out of sync with each other. Passages between islands in either the Bahamas or the Keys can be rough.

[t j]

When you fold the wings...or spread them...on the water for the first time please make a video. be sure to wear your life jacket.

[jdmcbean]

Forgot to add this...

[av8rps]

Badmash,

So here are my thoughts on what you are trying to accomplish...

Aircraft choice:

A Kitfox makes for an awesome floatplane, so it certainly would be a great choice for what you want to do. I love my Model 4-1200 with a Rotax 912 ul on floats, so I know that one would be a great choice.

But if you are a bigger person you might enjoy the slightly larger cabin of the Kitfox 5 through 7, along with more useful load. It too would make a great choice.

But in reality any Model Kitfox will make a good float plane. However, some will be better than others. To determine which will be the best performer, just find the model that will provide the lightest weight with the most horsepower, and the wing that provides the most lift/ wing area (and one you fit in comfortably). The earliest airplanes with their 2 stroke engines and high lift undercambered airfoils were real hotrods on floats mostly because they were so light. But now that we have lightweight 100 hp+ Rotax 912 engines, even the later airplanes are good performers on floats. So for those reasons, if you do the math you will discover the Model 4 fits right between the earliest hotrods, and the latest models, taking the best features from each. My 912 model 4 is light, so it performs really well off the water like the early airplanes, but yet will easily cruise 100 mph when on floats, like the later airplanes will do. That's why I like my 4 so much

And the floats are a big factor for operating off big water, big waves, and swells. The number one thing is to make sure they are big enough. Too small a float would be dangerous in rough ocean water conditions. Of course, you also will need a strong float, so stay away from the cheap junk you so often find for sale cheap. The cool thing is that we have good choices that 20 years ago we didn't have.

If I were doing what you are, and I wanted to keep the price reasonable, I would find a model 4-1200 with a 912s and put it on a set of Zenair 1150/1200 amphibs, and run a warp 3 blade prop with nickel leading edges.

If I was ok spending more, I'd buy a newer model Kitfox with a 912s Rotax and a warp prop and put on a set of Zenair 1450 amphibs. If you were ok spending more, a set of Czech 1300/1450 amphibs (if you can find any?), or maybe even a set of the new Aerocet 1500 amphib (big bucks). Clamar 1500s also could be used.

And if you just want to try something inexpensive to start, find an early Kitfox (or Avid) that is bare bones lightweight with a 532 or 582 2-stroke Rotax and put on straight floats (1150 Zenair). That would be a great little floatplane, and a very inexpensive option.

Also worth mentioning, a Just Aircraft Highlander would also be a great option. I have one, and know it makes a great floatplane. But will be more money than the other options.

Oh, and based on my experience with Full Lotus, I would not want to operate that float in rough water.

There's my take on the aircraft and floats.

Tomorrow I'll share my ideas on how to lift it the airplane with a crane...

Paul Seehafer
Central Wisconsin