Avid Magnum inquiry

[WWhunter]

Have a seat, open a beer, sit back, relax, and read my story. Maybe grab an extra beer just in case. Or just go to the very end and see if you can help me with a few questions.

As I have mentioned on here a few times, my son is currently in Afganistan and during his deployment, he asked me to be on the lookout for a plane for him to purchase when he returns. Young, coming back from the warzone, and a wad of money that is burning a hole through his pocket. He will be back stateside in a couple of weeks and wants me to have leads lined up for him to look at.

He has expressed a very high interest in getting a Kitfox, probably due to his dad steering him in that direction. Dads have a way of doing those things, don't they?
He had thought of a kit but being active duty his 'free' time is very limited. So he wanted something flying and affordable. We discussed the virtues of certified verses Experimental. Of course he would really like a 170B with an O-360 or similar but the realities of the cost of ownership are something he is aware of. Basically meaning it would be flown less than something with less fuel burn and maintance cost.

I searched and searched for a Kitfox that my son could afford that was in flying condition. In the intrim, I looked at a KF IV that was listed in the classifieds on this very site. I was hesitant to get it due to it not being finished and the fact that there was very little for a builders log. Eventually I decided to get this particular plane after a lot of thought. The price was fair for waht I was getting and I felt it could be put into flying condition in a realatively short amount of time and work. My plan was to bring the KF with to MD for the winter. I normally leave Mn during the winter to spend time with my spousal unit, who is at Ft. Meade, MD. I built/modified a trailer to haul it. I had it loaded and ready to go, but ended up having second thoughts due to a couple of issues.

So, now I am in MD with nothing to do, except browse Barnstormers, and post long threads on various airplane sites. IM'ing occassionally through SKYPE with my son, he has decided that maybe a KF IV will not be big enough for him and his wife to enjoy. So, 2 things, one is the fact I have a KF IVthat I need to figure out what I want to do with. The second thing, keep looking for something the number one son can buy/fly. Weight is an issue in his search for a useable plane. He and his wife probably weigh a combined 400+ lbs. and he would like the ability to carry another 100 lbs. for baggage. This weight combined, and then be able to add enough fuel to fly a reasonable cross country trip. Roughly 6.50 lb total useful load capability

He has expressed interest in the newer model Kitfox's models 5-7 but they are all much more expensive and over his budget. There have been a couple of 5/Vixens for somewaht decent prices but the one is Subaru powered and I suggested he try and stay with the tried and true Lyc or Rotax. One of the model 5's has the 912 with the 95 HP pistons but the plane seems terribly heavy to me for being a model 5. I think they addvertise it as 830 lbs. empty, isn't this quite high for a model 5? It's the red/white/blue one listed on BS. Personally not a huge fan of the paint job even though I am very patriotic.

He has found a couple of Avid Magnums for fair prices but hasn't been able to find out much about them. Any owners on here?

Is there anyone on here that has any experience with the Magnum? How do they fly? Parts available if there are issues?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Keith

[Av8r3400]

Warning: The following is an opinion and opinion only. It's worth every penny you just paid for it.

Avid Flyers and Avid Magnums are good airplanes. In some respects great airplanes. However they are orphans. Avid does not exist anymore. What is left of Avid Flyer is now Airdale Sport Plane and Supply, and Airdale has no support tooling for the Magnums at all. There are a number of parts that cross over from the Avid to the Magnum, but there are also many unique parts. Although Airdale is still in business, getting anything from Brett is often difficult due to his horribly bad communication practices.

Unless you and your son are builders and enjoy fabricating, I'd suggest staying away from the Magnums. There will be nothing available "off the shelf" for these planes.

As a side note, all Magnums have a 1700# gross weight and are therefore ineligible for light sport rules.

[Paul Z]

There is a Series 5 project for sale on Barnstormers, the is also a series 7 flying SLSA for sale search for Kitfox.

[WWhunter]

Thanks guys. He is not worried about being LSA complient. Heck, he is 26 and has to deal with getting a military flight physical so light sport isn't in his mindset. He think she will be perfect forever...didn't we all.

Paul,
He has seen those. I think he spends every waking minute looking at Barnstormers. He doesn't want a project and that one has a Subaru engine which he doesn't want. I have convinced him to stay with the tried and true Rotax or Lyc. I may have missed the Series 7 SLSA. But guessing it is probably above his budget.

[kmach]

Hi,

My model 5 Outback with some options in it has :

empty weight of 833 lbs.

gross weight 1550 lbs.

720 lbs useful load.

This is on wheels , with wheel skis add 40lbs to empty weight.

Cruise at 110 mph for 4.5 hrs on 22 us gallons of premium unleaded.

[kmach]

What kind of size is your son ?

I am 6'2" 225 lbs , I would not want anything smaller than a 5 .

In winter , dressed for -5F , with me and someone else its snug ! In the summer no problems with 2 my size.

[WWhunter]

Lets say, 'stocky'. I think he is 5'10"-11" and was 235+ when he left for Afganistan. He said he has lost some weight but not sure how much. Guessing he is 220 lbs. His wife is the same height (maybe a tiny bit taller) and I would guess she is 160+. This is why I stated earlier the 400 lb. for the two of them.

He is supposed to be returning stateside the end of the month. He will be stopping here in MD to see me before heading back to his duty station.

Just as you are saying, he thinks anything less than a model 5 will be very tight. I am hoping to go visit Kitfoxnick while he is here. This is so he can actually see and sit in an earlier model. He knows that in reality his wife probably won't be along much but he still has to buy for the occassional times that she does actually fly along. You guys with spouses know exactly what I am saying.

[Esser]

I don't think 830 sound exceptionally heavy. Most guys finish their 5-7s around 800. Even the factory LSA comes in around 800

[av8rps]

I have some experience with an Avid Magnum since I was hanging out with the Avid Aircraft gang when that airplane was created, and actually had some input on the design.

I had the chance to fly the 160 hp 0320 lyc powered Magnum both on wheels and floats, and can tell you that it is a VERY impressive airplane. If set up properly it will cruise at 130 mph on wheels (with pants) and 125 mph on straight floats (although the floats were small - 1500 Aqua's), and climb at 1800 fpm .

The cabin and the baggage area are HUGE. So huge that I actually felt it was too big (especially compared to the Avid Mark IV or Kitfox IV), as when I sat in it with my buddy I didn't even bump against the door frame (I'm 6'1" and 185 lbs fyi - and cabin is 44 inches wide, and wider with bubbled doors).

A typical Magnum will weigh around 1000 lbs empty, and gross out at either 1750, or 1850 if the builder bumped the gross in accordance with what the factory would bless (as I recall, it was just a number change, not any airframe strengthening). A friend of mine flew his Magnum on floats at 2000-2100 lbs regularly, but I personally would do all possible to stay within the limits the designer suggests as I hate playing test pilot any more than I already do.

In my opinion, the Highlander is essentially just a slightly smaller Magnum sans the flaperons. So when I see them for sale in the 30-40k price range, that makes them an incredible deal. So if you don't care about it being LSA, the Magnum is an incredible airplane for the money.

I have the factory video and some brochures for the Magnum, so if you decide to get serious about buying one let me know and I would be happy to share with you what I have. The video does a really good job of showing it's impressive flying abilities as well as its features.

Paul Seehafer
Model IV Kitfox 912ul Amphib
Highlander 912ULS
Lake Amphib
Avid Flyer Prototype

[WWhunter]

Paul and Esser,
Thank you. I will be completely honest in saying I know next to nothing about the Magnum, hence the questions. I do remember that I had looked at the specs and had put it on my short list many years ago when I was buying a kit. All I remembered was that there was something that seemed to come up frequently, possibly the gear, that was a weak spot. It may have been that or the fact that Avid itself melted into nothing, but I quit looking at it.
As far as the EW, I really have no idea what they weighed. I would have thought it was a lot light than a Super Cub.

Do you think that there is anything on the structure that would be hard to reconstruct if one needed to?