Current builder willing to talk to Prospective builder?

[N981MS]

I have done both (although not a Cruiser): Kitfox S6 (IO-240) and a STOL 750 (O-200) from a kit (with friends). I have about 700 hours in the Fox and about 40 in the Zenith.

Each has its pros and cons. For me the Kitfox fits my mission better. It will not take off as short as the 750 but it will take off plenty short. The Fox will out climb and out cruise the 750 with our setup. I suspect other setups do better.

Visibility in both is excellent. Both are solid built aircraft. I would say the build from a kit is no more difficult for one or the other. Just different techniques.

I am in the camp of buy the whole thing. If the unthinkable happens and the company is no longer around it will be difficult to find your parts. I guess the 750 gets the edge here in that you get plans that would enable building from plans if you decided not to buy "kits".

I do not think you can go wrong with either. Get a ride in each. You will love whichever you choose. If you can get to Dublin, GA sometime we can likely get you a ride in each back to back.

I think the decision comes down to the mission. If you need to be able to take off as short as possible; Zenith it is.

As to the nose wheel decision on a STOL it was John McBean that told me the nose wheel Fox takes off shorter because it accelerates faster. Less wing drag, thrust line better, I guess? The STOL 750 is all about short take off. They also have a lot of room under the tail for rotation such that you can take off at ridiculous deck angles and let those slats work for you. That part is FUN, FUN, FUN.

[av8rps]

Excellent write up comparing the Kitfox 7 and the Zenair 750.

But the part talking about the nosewheel vs tailwheel, even if the nosewheel aircraft lifted off sooner (which I find hard to believe - not one valdez STOL competitor uses a nosewheel) a nosewheel doesn't hold up in really rough and tough backcountry conditions. There's a reason bush pilots fly tailwheel aircraft.

Now, that's not to say the 701/750 series don't make good short field aircraft, because they do. But if you put one in rough and tough conditions that bush pilots and backcountry recreational pilots operate in regularly, you'd damage that nosewheel in short order. Ironically, both of my friends with Zenair 701's have damaged their nosewheels by landing hard in high rate of descents on hard surfaced runways. But the main gear was fine in both cases.

I think the nosewheel choice on the Zenair is simply about marketing airplane kits...more people can fly a nosewheel than a tailwheel.

Just my two cents worth...

Paul

"You might be a redneck pilot....if you've never flown a nosewheel airplane"

[N981MS]

I agree with av8rps on the tail wheel better in the bush. And I cannot personally attest to the nose wheel getting you off the ground sooner. I do think it was a conscious STOL decision for the 750 though.

The Zenith has unusual lines to say the least. These lines do not lend well to a tail wheel configuration. They do lend well to take off with a higher AOA than can be achieved with a tail wheel Kitfox on stock legs and wheels. The slats let the high AOA work. Our Advanced Flight Systems EFIS in the 750 (I know, overkill but we had our reasons) does dot display airspeed below 25 kts. It may be partially the extreme AOA concomitant with the low airspeed but the 750 flaps down will take off with AS at zero.

I neglected to mention comparison numbers earlier.
My Kitfox cruise-100kts
Our STOL 750 cruise- 70kts

I do not have hard numbers for climb but my gut tells me the Kitfox is 400-500 FPM more. Gut feeling take off roll for Kitfox about double the Zenith (125ft measured on a cool morning.)

I think a tail dragger 750 is not as "pretty" as a nose wheel.

The Kitfox on the other hand seems more at home with a tail wheel.

Can I be a Redneck pilot if I prefer tail wheels on everything except a 750? The pretty red one is our Kitfox. The others are not ours.

[av8rps]

Maxwell,

Thanks for the great education about the 750. Good info!

And I agree, if there is an airplane that looks better as a nosewheel than a taildragger, it would be the 750/701 Zenair.

And I also agree the way the aircraft was designed, it probably works better with a nosewheel.

And yes, you can still qualify as a Redneck pilot, even if you fly a 750 nosewheel.

Heck, the rest of the plane is so bush-like that putting a nosewheel on it by design is almost like if Henry Ford had put air dams, a hood scoop, and slicks on a model T at the factory. And that is most definitely something a redneck would do. So I'd say flying a 750 most definitely still qualifies you...

Paul

(attached a pic of the STOL I like...Gets off really good while still looking good. And if that's not enough you "just super-stol" it...kind of like going through the drive through and asking to have it super-sized. Hopefully I won't get censored off the forum for posting propaganda )

I agree with av8rps on the tail wheel...Snip snip... Can I be a Redneck pilot if I prefer tail wheels on everything except a 750? The pretty red one is our Kitfox. The others are not ours.