Kitfox 1200 Weight

[Steve_P]

All,
New to this forum and new owner of a 2013 Model IV 1200. My specific interest (for now) is concerning weight. My question is: According to the build tag on my Kitfox it is listed at 743lbs. It has no extras, bare bones avionics, Grove gear, bubble doors, and no special features (that I can see). Purchased as and appears to be a very stock model with a 912ULS engine. At 743 lbs, me (160lbs) my wife (120lbs) and 25 gallons of fuel per my calculations these total 1173lbs. So we can only carry 27lbs of luggage (or what ever)? I was thinking of upgrading the instrument panel and perhaps the gear but looks as though this would be a mistake is either of these will add weight. What am I missing?
Any comments are much appreciated!
Alabama Kitfox IV 1200

[avidflyer]

Wow, that's heavy. I did everything I could to avoid any extra weight when I rebuilt my Kitfox 4 1200, in fact the silver finish coat on most of it is poly spray. I do have a 12 or 13 lb battery and grove gear, and mine came in at 645. The cabane style bush gear is lighter than the grove, and a lithium battery would cut a few lbs, maybe 15-20 depending on what you have now. Mine is a bit heavier now, as I've added a heater, thermobob thermostat and inline coolant heater for winter heat. Maybe added 12 to 15 lbs at most. JImChuk

[DesertFox4]

Steve, I built a model 4-classic back in 2002-2003 with a 912, uls tri-gear with Grove gear, fairly basic panel, extended baggage compartment, wide body mod. Ivo 3-blade in-flight controllable prop. Mine weighed 659 lbs empty weight. Like Jim, I spent lots of time and effort to keep it as light as possible.
Unless yours has an awful lot of extra paint on it, it sounds like it’s empty weight is somewhat high for what you described.
I would get some accurate scales, remove all fuel and re-weigh it and see if it really is that heavy.
***If it really is lighter than is recorded in it’s operating limitations, you would have to get the FAA involved to be able to change it’s official empty weight. In the meantime, it would have to be loaded and flown as if it does have a 743 lbs. empty weight.
Enjoy your new Kitfox.

BTW Steve, welcome aboard. Hope you enjoy the folks here and the forums. We’d love a photo or two of your new Kitfox.😀👍
35ED1B2F-B59A-4C6D-9F37-7905385FA137.jpg
My 2003 Kitfox 4 Classic with 912 ULS

[avidflyer]

I don't think the empty weight appears in the operating limitations that I have seen. (not that they are all the same though) When the phase 1 is completed and it's signed off into phase 2, you list the stall speeds, and at what weight they were obtained. Most if not all would list the gross weight there. I agree though, weigh the plane again, and see what you have for sure. If it's lighter, make up a new W&B sheet. I've gotten all the paperwork the FAA has on several different planes I've owned, and I don't remember seeing a W&B sheet in any of them.

[109JB]

Empty weight changes do not involve FAA. Never have even for production airplanes. It happens all the time, repaint, add something, take something off, all these change empty weight and just needs to be recorded in the maintenance records.

[Steve_P]

Thanks guys for the feedback, good idea to check the weight and will do that ASAP. I feel the reported weight is not correct and hope I can find this is the case. Will post pictures soon.
Ala Kitfox 1200

[Slyfox]

I have, maybe optional, but have a weight and balance in my plane. That is prof in my opinion of the weight of the aircraft. My opinion, my 4 is 643 with big tires and such. I would, if you don't have a bunch of junk on your plane, reweigh it with the digital scales found at a FBO service center. that's what I did. than you will know all. good luck.

[jrthomas]

I weighed mine 1st with 3 sets of bathroom scales. Then my A&P buddy weighed it with his certified electronic scales. It suddenly gained a bunch of weight. The same thing happed when another friend weighed his new to him model 4. His data plate showed around 650 but the certified scales put both our planes in excess of 700. They're both model 4/1200 Speedster's with 912 and Grove gear. Draw your own conclusions.

[henrysamson]

I completed my Model 4 in 2013 and have since made several changes that you have talked about and my plane is lighter by my accounting although I still plan to re-weigh my plane in the near future to verify. There is no record of empty weight or gross weight with the FAA so there is no reason to change that. In fact, a certified airplane manual for a specific aircraft will often have several w/b changes entered in the w/b section along with the aircraft log book when stuff was added and deleted. The person who makes the log book entry at the completion of phase I enters the gross weight for the aircraft.

I did the following that lowered the weight:

New(er) avionics.
Replaced steam gauge instruments with glass (such as Uavionix AV30 which weighs much less than the instruments it replaces).
Replaced Whelen lights and strobes with AeroLED lights. The lights are not much lighter but he wiring is MUCH lighter plus I got rid of the power pack for the strobe.
Replaced AGM battery with lithium.
Removed some stuff I never used. Such as the speaker for the Com radio. I now have a GPS/com that does not support a speaker.
New ELT is 406 MHZ with a lithium battery which saved almost 2 pounds.

I added a few things that increased the weight:

Autopilot servos and mounting hardware. I already had a Dynon D10A installed to control it.
ADS-B in/out from Uavionix (EchoUAT). A little over a pound with its own the certified WAAS GPS (SkyFYX).

I've been told that even if you make no changes an airplane will somehow manage to gain weight. I'll see how accurate my accounting is after I weigh it again. Don't assume that the newer avionics will weigh more. If you go for a big screen glass display that may be so but the small 3 inch instruments weigh almost nothing and are a fairly easy upgrade.

Hank

[Steve_P]

Great info!! thanks again everyone. I am running all steam gauges currently and plan to upgrade to glass shortly so that hopefully will drop the weight some??.
Steve