Kitfox Aircraft Stick and Rudder Stein Air Grove Aircraft TCW Technologies Dynon Avionics AeroLED MGL Avionics Leading Edge Airfoils Desser EarthX Batteries Garmin G3X Touch
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 21 to 22 of 22

Thread: How many are installing/switching to the Yamaha Apex Engine?

  1. #21
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2020
    Location
    Steilacoom, WA
    Posts
    729

    Default Re: How many are installing/switching to the Yamaha Apex Engine?

    I think this has been an interesting discussion with valid points from all. I don't know Rik and can't speak for his intentions but I don't think he was trying to make anyone mad. A few observations from a random idiot:

    I've been around Yamaha products my entire adult life. My first motorcycle was an RD400, a two stroke street bike that was obsolete and hard to find by the time I owned one. That bike was shockingly fast period, let alone for being a 400cc bike. I also owned two generations of Ford SHO Taurus (Tauri?), a second generation 3.0 V6 and third generation 3.4 V8. The 3.0 was insane and over delivered in every category, including being bullet proof. The latter was a Cosworth block/crank and pure Yamaha above the head gaskets. The shockingly fast description applied to both of those vehicles too. Years of reading motorcycle magazines and seeing multi brand "shoot outs" it was common to see a comparison of 750cc bikes, and there was Yamaha with its 700cc offering. To assume it was the slow bike of the crowd would be a mistake often repeated. In short, they know what they're doing. I never owned an R1 but they are pretty much the final word in fast bikes, and the Apex engine shares a lot of design with the R1 motor.

    $18k to freshen a non-certified O-200 does seem excessive. I have to assume it still includes crankcase work, line bore, all new bearings, crank inspections and some fancy paint (the least important part). I can't defend the overhaul quote other than to say they will probably stand behind their work, and while an O-200 is anything but modern it is a very dependable motor. Not half bad as an ice maker either, am I right?

    Looking at the table presented I have to wonder why one would order a new 912 if they are going with the Zipper big bore. You have tear it at least part way down to install the kit and your warranty vaporizes when the Zipper kit is installed (my reading, not verified). If 80/100 hp isn't enough then I would look for a decent used engine and do the upgrade. And (also from my brief reading), the big bore kit won't get you to 150hp unless you also split the case and do some crank work, add a turbo, etc. So it seems the $19k (rounded up) for a 912 in a crate isn't the smartest place to start.

    Oh, yes. Junk yard motors. If you're going it on your own would you really pull a dirty engine out of a 10+ year old snow machine (or car) and fly behind it just because you heard it run once? I saw the reference to the Audi turbo diesel in the Raptor. Lets just say that Peter gets trashed for a whole lot of reasons, one of which is ignoring the advice of Audi engineers who developed that engine and would like to see him succeed.
    Like the Yamaha engine, I have no question the Audi diesel is strong enough to fly behind (er, in front of). If Peter's plane was not 1000 lbs overweight and he accepted help from the right people his program would be a lot further along.
    About 18 months ago I was driving a rented, nearly brand new SUV when some drugged up ladies in a small car crossed the centerline and hit us head on. The impact destroyed the 5k+ pound SUV. Full air bag deployment, we're lucky to be alive. That engine is no doubt available as a low mile, perfectly good engine. No way in h*** I would fly behind that thing without holding every piece in my hands first. Low mile cars don't find their way to a wrecking yard because someone didn't like the paint.

    It is my understanding that Edge Performance and other companies like Aeromomentum build engines by hand, and do not sell junk yard motors. They have a reputation to build/uphold and they are entitled to a profit. I don't see the beef there. They put a lot of time into engineering the motor mount, cooling/fuel systems and keeping the gooey stuff inside - and it's harder than it seems.
    Kitfox 5 (under construction)
    Commercial SE/ME, CFII

  2. #22
    Senior Member Dave S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    St Paul, MN
    Posts
    1,833

    Default Re: How many are installing/switching to the Yamaha Apex Engine?

    Alex,

    Quote "........an O-200 is anything but modern it is a very dependable motor. Not half bad as an ice maker either, am I right?......."

    Are you right???...lemme see.......that last small continental I flew behind apparently had a moisture detector as it could fine two molecules of H2O within a 5 nautical mile radius, put it in the carb and make an ice cube.
    Dave S
    Kitfox 7 Trigear (Flying since 2009)
    912ULS Warp Drive

    St Paul, MN

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •