Need help evaluating a barn find Kitfox Series 5

[Dave S]

Eric,

Many of your questions I could not answer without seeing the project; however, I would offer the following input.

While photos are not real good for someone else to assess many things, the photos of the fuselage covering are sufficient, in my opinion, to think that the fuselage should be stripped and recovered. The misc damage, poor finishing and questions you have about what process was used in parts of the finishing would cause me to want to strip it and start over. Also, while it is an esthetic thing, the finishing of the shape of the end of the VS isn't too pretty and that cannot be fixed unless the fabric is removed - pretty easy to do with the fabric off.

I cannot see enough of the wings in the photo to venture a guess on them.

Since you mentioned you are not familiar with fabric covering but are considering building a fabric covered aircraft, by all means - get the Poly fiber book titled "How to cover an aircraft" if you are going to use their system. Really straight forward, practical and would solve a ton of questions you have and it is essential to using their products.

On the lack of documentation, I would go to, call up, the horse's mouth (your faa MIDO {Manufacturing Inspection District Office}) and ask them since they are to ones having the final call on the airworthiness of the aircraft anyway. I found our office very helpful and they do have work arounds for unique situations.

I have three friends who built S5s and they all really, really like them.

[Eric Page]

Thanks, Dave.

Your concerns about the fuselage covering process, and the shape of the vertical stab end, echo my own. I think it’s probably a write-off and will have to be redone. I strongly suspect that I’ll find similar conditions on the wings and control surfaces. Since I couldn’t inspect them due to the place and manner they were stored, it’s a bit of a crap shoot.

i posted the builder’s log question on the EAA forum and got a reply from a DAR saying it’s not a big deal and my proposal to have the owner sign a statement about the work he’s done would be sufficient. I’ll definitely confirm with the MIDO, in case my DAR got up on the wrong side of the bed on inspection day.

Thanks again!

[bbs428]

I would strip it and go over everything from page one until your satisfied that it was done correctly or you do it to your satisfaction. It will be more work, trust me but the savings over a new kit might be substantial. Check for corrosion everywhere.

I purchased a older 5 outback kit. It was not as far along this one. I removed what was done and had no choice but to redo most of the control system for my own peace of mind. Also had to do a lot of corrosion control as some of the powder coat was compromised and rust had wicked up and under it in places. My factory built wings were in good shape after 20 years in a barn. Aluminum spars just needed to be cleaned of critters and alodined. Hysol glue joints were still very good.

All the best. Nice find!

[rv9ralph]

You could also check with Kitfox for recommendations if the original bill of sale is not located.

Ralph

[Eric Page]

Apparently Kitfox Aircraft have been dealing with this problem for awhile. There's a page on the factory website that deals with this exact problem.

[PapuaPilot]

I would also lean towards taking the fabric off the fuselage and redoing it. Drips and runs are almost impossible to correct and tend to show through the finished job. While the fabric is off you should go through everything. Like others said there could be poor workmanship, corrosion, etc. That was the case on my model 5 Outback, I found several things that needed to be redone on mine including misaligned control pivots, tight rudder pedals, corrosion, too tight bolts, etc. IMO I would offer a little less than 20K due to the damage and unknowns.

Are you going to be happy with the 1400# gross weight? If you go with a Rotax it shouldn't be a problem. I have a 1550 GW Model 5 with a Continental IO-240 and have a UL of 657# and ~500# with full fuel. I wouldn't be happy with a ~500# UL, which leaves only ~350# with full fuel.

FYI you can download a free copy of the Poly Fiber manual. I believe it is on their website.

The factory should be able to supply almost everything on the model 5. Get the larger elevator.

If you get the plane there are plenty of us that have built the Model 5. I have a complete manual and would be happy to give you copies of any pages you need.

It's a good idea to get a statement from the seller. Other than that you will need to document all of your work using photos, dates/signatures in the build manual, etc.

[avidflyer]

Just to be clear, runs on the inside of the fuselage from poly brush aren't really that bad of a thing. That shows that the fabric was saturated and the poly brush is locked to the fabric. Very dry on the inside would be worse then runs. Runs on the outside are a different story, poly brush doesn't sand well at all. May have some success flattening them with an iron over a plastic sheet. The poly brush will melt and spread out somewhat. Once everything cools, the plastic should pop off. Also, you mentioned poly spray and UV blocker as if they are different things. The poly spray is the UV blocker. JImChuk

[alexM]

I'm in Tacoma and I'm just getting rolling on my KF 5 project. You're welcome to come take a look at it, and I wouldn't mind seeing this project of yours. I've already been purging some extra parts (duplicates that have been replaced by KF 7 pieces).

I'm going to guess that your current cabane gear was the factory standard bungee gear from that time period. The single piece Grove was considered an upgrade at the time and now we've come full circle - though the shocks are an order of magnitude better than bungee cord. I could be wrong on all of that, but I have slept in a Holiday Inn Express recently.

I'm having no problems getting parts/support from the McBeans. In fact everything I've gotten from them has been an upgrade. Better design, better made, easier to build.

[DesertFox4]

Some tribal knowledge sent to me in the last month. Two separate model 5 non-Vixens with broken rudder pedals. One was on short final with a crosswind. No damage or injuries due to above average pilot skills and a little luck. Fix your pedals guys. The same pedals are used in Vixens, Safaris and Outbacks. Taildraggers put way more stress on the pedals than do nose wheel models.


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[Eric Page]

Some tribal knowledge sent to me in the last month. Two separate model 5 non-Vixens with broken rudder pedals. [...] The same pedals are used in Vixens, Safaris and Outbacks. Taildraggers put way more stress on the pedals than do nose wheel models.

Good intel; thanks. Makes sense that all models used the same pedal assembly. I guess it must have been an oversight by the SkyStar folks that restricted the Service Bulletin to only Vixen models.