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Thread: Project 5 build thread

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  1. #1
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    Boy it's an amazing difference when the plane is right there in your garage and your flyable plane is down for annual. Last night I measured the horizontal stabilizer relative to the vertical fin and adjusted the struts per the manual. Got it perfect on my second try. The tail structure is actually quite rigid when everything is in place.

    Next I moved to the front of the plane and removed the rudder pedal assemblies, master cylinders and floor boards so I could install the Clickbond floating nutplates. I got down to bare metal per the manufacturer directions and went through the mental process of how it was all going to go but I packed it in for the night before mixing any adhesive. I knew the metal wasn't perfectly free of primer and wanted to get a fresh look before adding stress.

    I wanted to test mount the rudder but I could see that was going to take some patience so I put tools away and cleaned up.

    When I was done with work today I slipped out into the garage and got to work. I spent about an hour with my Dremel tool making sure the metal was bare. I was thinking of Bryan Bowen's video where his Dremel caught fire and I was honestly worried that mine was about to do the same. When everything was bare and perfect I cleaned everything with denatured alcohol. I mixed the adhesive and then took one more single pass wipe on all the surfaces to be bonded, then got to work gluing the nutplates in the holes. It went pretty smoothly with the rubbery one-use tool holding them centered and tightly in place. I had time to orient them squarely from the underside and noted that there was squeeze out everwhere but no mess. What are the chances?
    IMG_20200903_181144.jpg
    IMG_20200903_181205.jpg
    You can see where I'll have to come back with the epoxy primer and touch up the bare metal. I had a comment on facebook about them debonding in service at an airline. The rudder pedals will undoubtedly go in and out of the plane a number of times before I cover them up so I can always change my mind and go to riveted ones.
    IMG_20200903_185349.jpg
    Another shot of the floating nutplates, washers and machine screws I'm using for floor board attachment. I owe a thank you to whoever suggested Tinnerman nuts in someone else's build thread. This is just a slightly overboard version of the same idea.

    Once the adhesive was curing I moved to the back of the plane and set about installing and adjusting the rudder. One challenge I'll have is that my rudder is already built, and the ribs that were in the vertical fin were removed (and damaged) by the previous owner.
    In order for me to get the ribs in the rudder and vertical fin to match with any continuity I will need to have the rudder mounted while I fit the ribs in the fin.
    IMG_20200903_205223.jpg
    Funny story here. I remember the first time I looked over the rudder I was kind of crabby at how big the access holes were for the hinge hardware. Holy smokes, that is going to take some patience and some practice picking AN3-7A bolts up off the floor when there's covering on. I'm already picturing a home made tool that will make the job easier.

    Anyway the other challenge is that I can't produce the dimensions called for in the book because the fairing is already bonded onto the rudder and my best guess is that it's about 0.2" from where book says. I'm going to dry fit the fiberglass piece for the vertical fin and see what it takes to get a uniform gap.

    I'm pretty sure I want to go with a COM antenna in the vertical fin, my GPS bump under the turtle deck like I've seen on this forum and my ELT inside the tailcone. My transponder antenna will be the only penetration, which will be on the bottom in the factory location. Right now my plan is LED strobe/position lights on the wingtips with white to the rear, and no wires or bulbs headed to the tail (except the stab trim actuator of course).
    Kitfox 5 (under construction)
    Commercial SE/ME, CFII

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    A couple of nights ago I diagrammed out the stacks of washers needed to center my master cylinders, then cleaned the washers with acetone and tiny drops of super glue to make thick stacks. It was a pretty easy way to get them all in place. I touched up the bare metal at the edges of my Clickbond fasteners with two part primer and decided to skip the color coat touch up until another day.

    Last night I had cut the nylon tubes for the rudder cables guides and finished the ends so they were all nice and smooth. It took quite a while because I don't know what the right tool for cutting the nylon tubing is. I didn't want to cut it with any type of shears because I thought it would crush the tube flat. I tried a straight cut hacksaw type edge on a multi-tool (real slow going, admittedly with a tired blade) and also a small cut off wheel on my Dremel. That was barely any faster and the material tended to melt back together after you cut it. It's some damn tough material. I stuck it out and got the parts made, and yes I still need to make a couple more.

    IMG_20200908_165454.jpg
    I didn't take a picture, but this evening I spent time clearing the old adhesive out of the steel portions of the fuselage where the nylon tubes go. I chased a few of them out by just using a 5/16" drill bit chucked up in a pin vise, but as I got closer to the tail they got harder and the drill bit would get stuck. So I grabbed my Dremel and a small diamond grit tool a lot smaller than 5/16 and worked away with a mirror, a light and frequent checks with a scrap of tube until they would all barely slide through.

    I did not bond them tonight. I'm wising up and keeping a list of things that need Hysol on them, because it seems like you always use what you mix and then later think of somewhere you could have used an extra glob.

    I made a trip to the hangar today to get some more of the pieces from the various tubs and boxes my project came in. On the short list were the aluminum lids that go on the compartments under the seat and the baggage compartment sack.
    IMG_20200908_201712.jpg
    IMG_20200908_205658.jpg
    I'm super glad I brought home the baggage sack and test fit it because it allowed me to see a conflict between my seat attach hardware where it wraps around the horizontal tubes and the very forward edge of the baggage sack where it likewise wraps around the same tube. Not a big deal and the solution is obviously some tailoring of the baggage sack to allow for the seat clamps.
    IMG_20200908_201542.jpg
    I now know exactly which item in my pile of parts is the floor of the baggage compartment. I remember originally thinking it was a floor board for the main cabin but that ship has sailed and the big piece didn't go along. Next trip to the hangar I guess and then I'll get to figure out how it is mounted.

    My head is churning forward to the step where I drill and attach the thin aluminum sides of the center console to the top piece. In fitting the floor boards I referred to the manual and found that the sidewalls don't sit on top of the floor (the way they show in image showing the seat tray covers), they tuck under the floor boards. I had been fooled by the work of the original builder who countersunk the holes on those holes common to the floor boards. I thought it looked okay that way, and certainly easiest if you need to mess with something in the center console. But they sure look more finished with them tucked under the floor boards.
    IMG_20200908_205256.jpg
    I need to trim the very back corner of the thin aluminum sides where it is binding up under pressure of the floor board and seat tube, causing it to bow outward.

    I also got my rudder cables and seat belts from the hangar. The holes for the shoulder belt attach points are not drilled, so I know there's more primer touch up in my near future.
    Last edited by alexM; 09-08-2020 at 11:54 PM.
    Kitfox 5 (under construction)
    Commercial SE/ME, CFII

  3. #3
    Senior Member jiott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    Never had a screw back out in 900 hours on the side panels. The bottom screws are machine screws that go into tinnerman nuts under the floor boards; the top ones are the regular self-tapping screws.
    Jim Ott
    Portland, OR
    Kitfox SS7 flying
    Rotax 912ULS

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    Tonight I ran the cables for the left side.

    I should say "I made a meat hook on the end of a cable, and then decided to stop and use the super glue trick". Then I routed the cables. Got the pulleys backwards the first time (the cables cross and touch), then it all came together.

    I got all the hardware sorted then set up some good light and attached the cable ends to the ruddee pedal torque tubes. Still need to torque and install cotter pins obviously.
    PXL_20201001_040424426.jpg
    PXL_20201001_041103461.jpg
    Kitfox 5 (under construction)
    Commercial SE/ME, CFII

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    The other night I got the right side cables slipped into place and routed to the tail cone where they splice to the left side. I noticed that (in the series 5, anyway) it looked like the swaged fittings would rub on the diagonal fuselage tube and considered staggering them to avoid contact.
    PXL_20201002_021245531.jpg
    I read through various forum posts here and found I'm not the first to ask, and that it's nothing to worry about once the cables are properly set. It would also likely result in the Nicopress fittings hitting the guide tubes before reaching full travel and that would be bad. And yes, I'll be adding some heat shrink over those splices.
    You can see that in spite of my crazy questions in another thread regarding use of Spectra for Kevlar for rudder cables I'm going with the 7x19 1/8" SS cables that were in my box.

    I've also read through the builders tips and read the posts regarding setting up the cables and I no longer fear getting them uneven or needing turnbuckles to make up for my errors. This forum is such a great resource.

    Anyway, I can't complete the cable length setting until I've worked out the exact rudder location. Since my rudder was completed by builder #1 I need it in place so I can install my vertical fin ribs to align with them, install the fairing at the aft edge of the vertical fin and then fine tune where my rudder hangs. It is probably exactly where it is going to live, but un-cutting cable is a skill I don't have.

    That means I need to stop with the cables and start with the ribs, so I spent the end of my build session doing the initial fitting of those. You'll see that I obtained fresh ribs from Kitfox which would be installed if this were a series 7.
    PXL_20201002_035412851.jpg
    These all went well enough and sit relaxed in position. I have two questions for the gallery before I close this post out. See below:
    PXL_20201002_035426658.jpg
    The manual for the series 5 has you take a significant chunk out and bond it back in, but that is because there were no lightening holes. The series 7 manual says you remove a chunk, but the image shows a kerf cut which seems to imply I'll be able to flex and wiggle the rib in place over that narrow tube. Is that going to work, or do I need to remove a wider section? I'm quite sure I can figure it out but the next one has be more stumped.
    PXL_20201003_150549776.jpg
    The last rib in my pile would appear to be the bottom one, but mine is in one piece and it looks like I'll have to cut it into two. I vaguely recall seeing this somewhere but my renewed search comes up empty, and my RTFM session in both the series 5 and series 7 books don't say a word about cutting this rib. I've got an approximate dimension figured out where to cut between the two holes, just looking for a sanity check before I proceed.
    Kitfox 5 (under construction)
    Commercial SE/ME, CFII

  6. #6
    Senior Member Eric Page's Avatar
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    Quote Originally Posted by alexM View Post
    I have two questions for the gallery before I close this post out. [...]

    The manual for the series 5 has you take a significant chunk out and bond it back in, but that is because there were no lightening holes. The series 7 manual says you remove a chunk, but the image shows a kerf cut which seems to imply I'll be able to flex and wiggle the rib in place over that narrow tube. Is that going to work, or do I need to remove a wider section? I'm quite sure I can figure it out but the next one has be more stumped.

    The last rib in my pile would appear to be the bottom one, but mine is in one piece and it looks like I'll have to cut it into two. I vaguely recall seeing this somewhere but my renewed search comes up empty, and my RTFM session in both the series 5 and series 7 books don't say a word about cutting this rib. I've got an approximate dimension figured out where to cut between the two holes, just looking for a sanity check before I proceed.
    Alex, here are a couple of photos of my fuselage that might help (ignore the shoddy adhesive application by builder #1). I suspect the lower rib you recall seeing was on my build.

    I've exchanged a few emails with Debra McBean recently, preparing a parts order, and that bottom rib is one of the items I'll need to replace when I get the welding done. She had this to say about that rib: "That bottom rib is cut by the builder in half to fit into the Vert Stab."
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    Eric Page
    Building: Kitfox 5 Safari | Rotax 912iS | Dynon HDX
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    Map of Landings

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Page View Post
    Alex, here are a couple of photos of my fuselage that might help (ignore the shoddy adhesive application by builder #1). I suspect the lower rib you recall seeing was on my build.

    I've exchanged a few emails with Debra McBean recently, preparing a parts order, and that bottom rib is one of the items I'll need to replace when I get the welding done. She had this to say about that rib: "That bottom rib is cut by the builder in half to fit into the Vert Stab."
    Thanks Eric,
    I cut that bottom rib last night and I made a single angled cut on my vertical fin rib and it slips perfectly over the diagonal brace tube.
    PXL_20201005_001728427.jpg
    PXL_20201005_001717290.jpg
    Now that everything is "dry fit" I will remove them all and sand them with 220 per the manual, then work out my bonding strategy.
    Kitfox 5 (under construction)
    Commercial SE/ME, CFII

  8. #8
    Senior Member PapuaPilot's Avatar
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    I usually use a pair of long hemostats for jobs like that. The tips flex enough to hold an AN3 bolt and they can be unlocked with one hand.
    Phil Nelson
    A&P-IA, Maintenance Instructor
    KF 5 Outback, Cont. IO-240
    Flying since 2016

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Project 5 build thread

    Inching forward. I had a bit of time to burn waiting for my Aircraft Spruce order. It was scheduled to show up yesterday but somewhere during the week I got an alert from UPS saying there had been an issue with the truck and the arrival would be TBD.
    That order contained my Super Fill and my epoxy varnish, which I would need before getting far. I busied myself making the cross-wise rib braces and tacking them first with superglue and then filleting with Hysol. I got the lower ribs all fit flush to the tail post fairing, then glued and clamped those ribs using thick steel rulers to help keep the fairing fare. With every batch of Hysol I mixed up I was able to fillet the tail end of all the fin ribs to the fairing.
    PXL_20201024_000841707.jpg
    The pic above was taken before I came back and cleaned things up. I'm getting better at applying adhesive but still glad this area will get covered up. I added some flox to the Hysol to fill the gaps at the very bottom of the tail post. I'm sure this is a potential water trap so I wanted it filled smoothly and without holes.
    PXL_20201024_001130560.jpg
    Speaking of Hysol, above is showing the way I upped my game. I have a lifetime supply of the 3oz paper cups and tongue depressors, the cheap but pretty darn accurate digital scale (turns out my other scale really only reads in grams which would be fine for large batches of adhesive but not when you're mixing up just a little). I zero out the scale with the paper cup on it, so what you're seeing there is a tongue depressor which weighs 2.58grams.
    That irrigating syringe has now squirted several batches of adhesive. When done, I pull the plunger out and clean up the rubber piece with alcohol and just leave the other part to kick off completely. The next day I dig in there with a long screw driver and pluck out the chunk of adhesive cleanly.
    PXL_20201024_001033028.jpg
    While I was holding down the couch yesterday the UPS man showed up on the original date with my package from Spruce! Perfect timing. I had just finished creating the balsa wood pieces for the top of the vertical fin and fit them in place. The Hysol is just photo bombing here but the epoxy varnish, Super Fill, torque seal,tools etc are all new.
    PXL_20201024_000804503.jpg
    Prior to bonding and clamping, which I did last night.
    PXL_20201024_173451277.jpg
    This morning I shaped the wood starting with 80 grit and my random orbit sander, then 120, and then I hand sanded with 120 to create "a pleasing shape" per the directions in the manual.
    Before opening up my Super Fill I pulled out the old containers which came with my project. I wanted to see if they were still usable. The old stuff seemed stiff so I wrote it off, which is a shame because I was clearly the first person to open the containers.
    After I opened the new containers I realized it was pretty stiff material too, though not like the old stuff. I mixed it up and while I can't say it "flows" it was at least easier to stir and mix (note: It's also pretty cold here today, which of course makes everything not flow very well).

    My youngest son wants to learn to make fiberglass parts, so I might give him the old stuff which might still work for making a plug.

    The Super Fill says it needs to cure above 70 degrees F which my garage definitely is not today, so my radiant heater that is normally pointed at me is pointed at the tail of my plane. It's all warm to the touch (not hot) but the cure time means I'm dead in the water for sanding tail parts until tomorrow sometime.

    So I went forward to the center console side walls where I needed to open up the #30 pilots and deburr everything with my new tool. I need to install my new batch of Click-bond nutplates, which will require an hour or so of prep to get them ready (and I'll need my heater back).
    Last edited by alexM; 10-24-2020 at 02:34 PM.
    Kitfox 5 (under construction)
    Commercial SE/ME, CFII

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