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Thread: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

  1. #11

    Join Date
    Jun 2019
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    Alfred, Ontario
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    10

    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    Thanks for your comments Jeff. Do you use one notch or full flap on final?
    Rolfer

  2. #12
    Senior Member Maverick's Avatar
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    Mar 2017
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    Phoenix
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    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    From what I remember from learning to fly was to fly the airplane, not the instruments. Obviously ASI calibration is truly important but, doing take off and landings will familiarize yourself with the characteristics of the plane. Glancing at the ASI is necessary but once you are committed, you don't look at the ASI, you fly the plane right down to the ground. I used to land anywhere and everywhere I could, fields in the Texas Panhandle, flat places in the Arizona desert, dirt, grass, gravel, paved runways, high altitude and low altitude strips, etc. over and over and over to the point that the feel of the plane determined approach speeds. I practiced with 2 passengers as well as weight in the baggage compartment, alone, half fuel, full fuel, etc. It was amazing what you can make a Kitfox do. While instruments are important, before all the electronic wizardry came along, people were taught to know the airplane from the seat of your pants. Practice, practice, practice. . .

  3. #13
    Senior Member Slyfox's Avatar
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    felts field, spokane
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    1,327

    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    absolutely.
    now days you have all these aids for flying, landing. me I just set up for 50 over the numbers and never look at the asi again. I try to 3 point for short landing. with that said as I'm getting close to landing I'll pull back on the stick slightly, if it wants to go back up I'm not slow enough. should be able to pull back and the tail go down, go full back and yes land on the tail first than the main come down for a nice smooth landing. I personally don't use flaps, my fox will slow real nice and I can land and be turning 180 within 300ft most times way shorter than that. why no flaps. I don't know, maybe because it's too much of a reach for my short arms. maybe some day I'll put an extension on it. don't know. I also don't like the nose being forced down and tail won't come down with them on. I do know I can major slip my bird right from the midfield and just relax the rudder for my turns, way fun. with my prop set for flat and can slow down real good. just me I guess, but I fly seat of the pants all the time. just glance on short final for my speeds. my suggestion is to go up to altitude and find when your plane stalls and use that plus 15 for final. go to about 5+ for over the numbers. the asi might be wrong.
    steve
    slyfox
    model IV 1200-flying
    912uls
    IVO medium in-flight
    RV7A-flying
    IO-360
    constant speed prop

  4. #14

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    Jun 2019
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    Alfred, Ontario
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    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    Thanks for your excellent advice guys......much appreciated!

  5. #15
    Senior Member
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    KDKB (Dekalb, Illinois)
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    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    Here's my opinionated comments:

    My airplane I feel that full flaperons is not safe, so I mechanically limited the flaperons for one
    notch max, AND I removed the trim assist spring I had also. I feel the two of them combined
    to create what I believe is a tailplane stall. There's a thread on the forum about it if you search
    on trim assist spring I believe.

    I make pretty much every landing with a notch of flaperons, and I 3-pt land always. I'm in the
    school of thought that wheel landings are actually two landings, so I just like to put everything
    down at once.

    I also experimented quite a bit with AOA systems, and in the end I don't use them in my airplane.
    The airplane tells you what it's doing.

    If it's a breezy day, I tend to fly most of base and final at 60'ish. If it's calm, and feels safe I often
    fly final at around 45 and short final on the edge of needing power. When I first started flying the
    airplane I was typically much faster, and experienced a lot of floating like you are. For a while I
    solved this with wheel landings and just planted it, and used the brakes.

    On a normal day I get a little past runway end on downwind, pull power back to about 1500 rpm,
    slow it to below 80, pull in 1 notch of flaperons, and adjust descent for about 500 fpm, and 60 mph.
    Then as I get on final I decide whether to slip, or just power back and slow down more.

    Jeff

  6. #16

    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Alfred, Ontario
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    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    Jeff, thanks for your detailed reply. On a calm day I was flying 55 on short final and this appears to be too fast for my 1200’ strip. I’ll be using yours and other guys recommendations in the future.
    Cheers, Rolfer.

  7. #17
    Super Moderator Av8r3400's Avatar
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    Jan 2009
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    Merrill, WI
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    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    My plane is a model IV, so it is a little lighter therefore lands a little slower. Here is a video of several landings on my 900' strip. The speeds I call out are all in MPH and are indicated. Accuracy at that slow speed is not great.

    Last edited by Av8r3400; 08-02-2019 at 06:46 AM.
    Av8r3400
    Kitfox Model IV
    The Mangy Fox
    912UL 105hp Zipper
    YouTube Videos

  8. #18

    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Alfred, Ontario
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    10

    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    Thanks for sharing your video. Getting in and out of your 900’ strip with tall trees each end must be a real challenge. My 1200’ strip with no obstructions looks easy by comparison.

  9. #19

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    Caldwell, ID
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    122

    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    I recommend going out somewhere where you have no pressure for a make or break landing, and practice spot landings for a few hours.
    Bartman
    Retired USAF
    Kitfox 5
    N617BR

  10. #20

    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Alfred, Ontario
    Posts
    10

    Default Re: New Kitfox 5 Tailwheel owner - landing problem

    Yes practice, practice is the key. This is what I’ve been doing in the last few days and now I’m landing on my short trip without excessive float. Thanks guys, for all your good advice.
    Rolfer

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