Tempest oil filter

[jeffbock]

Have been using the Tempest oil filter labled "For Rotax" Which had two features over the Rotax filter I like. 1) Has tabs to secure safety wire. and
2) Has an internal magnetic chip collector.
Am hearing bad things about this filter in spite of the thought that Tempest must have a large liability issue with calling it "For Rotax"
Anyone have opinions or real experience's with the issue? Thanks, JeffB

[Dick B in KY]

What things have you been hearing about the Tempest? Just getting ready to switch over to them on my 912 ULS. Seems the writeup on them was comparable to Rotax in every way.

Dick B

[Dave S]

I like the safety wire setup. The 912's have a magnetic plug in the side of the engine...wonder what the difference would be with the magnetic chip collector in the filter too; and, if a person can see it when cutting the filter can open?

The can burst pressure is advertised as higher than the Rotax filter - that can't be bad.

Anyone know if the Tempest filter has an anti-backflow valve like the Rotax Filter?

[Wheels]

Just had that conversation with Rotech research in Canada. My engine is dripping fuel from the pipe and Rotech thinks its the lack of a check valve in the tempest filter. I have a model IV and the tank is high which doesn't help any.

[jrevens]

Interesting conversation.

There have been built-in anti-back flow and bypass relief valves in many oil filters for years now. You would think if Rotax thinks an anti-back flow valve is now required, that Tempest would put one in their filter. Should be easy to find out. I think we'd all like to know. Tempest seems to have a good reputation for design and quality.

Out of curiosity, how in the world could the lack of an anti-back flow valve in the oil filter possibly cause dripping fuel from a "pipe"?

I'm a big proponent of using high quality oil filters and oil in my engines. If the Rotax filter is truly the best, I'll use it exclusively. I'm a little leery of the perception I have that Rotax may charge excessively for expendable items on their engines, that they have designed just a little bit differently from readily available aftermarket alternatives to, possibly, corner the market on those over-priced items. I'm not saying that is the case in this instance, just a possibility with many companies. In my prior life that was one of my aggravations with Lennox equipment, for example..

[Wheels]

I hear ya.
But none the less, or is it numb the less? You have heard of 912s that leak a little oil into a cylinder after sitting for a long time. Then during burping procedure there is a noticeable effort required to turn the blade. the offending cylinder has oil in it and the lower spark plug can be removed to drain that oil. Where did it come from? The oil tank. Can it leak past the exhaust valve because not all of the valves are closed at the same time depending on where in the four stroke cycle, the engine has arrested. At some time, the intake and the exhaust valve are loosely closed are they not? I'm not sure, but other than a major breakage in the rocker arm assembly, piston rings, etc, I haven't a clue. What do you think?

[Flybyjim]

I for one am willing to pay the price of the filters from Rotax, they designed the engines so I can fly my planes with a comfortable feeling of reliability. They bore the cost of design, development and I am happy to pay a rather small fee to keep my engines running to their standards, I am not an engineer they are. We all spend many $$$ to get into the air, I want the best opportunity to stay in the air.
Just one persons thoughts, no I am not a wealthy man, I do okay.

Jim

[kitfox2009]

The safety wire issue is easily resolved by tightening a hose clamp on the filter. It's not even necessary to un-wire it for filter removal.
Have close to 700 hours on mid 90's UL . Always use Rotax filters and Mobil 4T synthetic. Never added between changes yet. Twenty dollar filters are not a huge expense in the big picture.
Cheers
Don

[kmach]

Use genuine Rotax parts on a 912. My 2 cents.

I too use the hose clamp on the Rotax filter. safety wired to the magnetic plug.

Something to think of as well, there could very likely be a warranty issue if your engine still is under warranty.

[Av8r3400]

I'm a firm believer in the Rotax filter also.

I have never had a filter loosen on my auto or truck in the hundreds of thousands of miles I've driven. Why would the one on the plane loosen if it was installed properly. Again, just because the 1920s design Lyo-Conti-Saurus engines did it doesnt make it gospel.

[jrevens]

......
I have never had a filter loosen on my auto or truck in the hundreds of thousands of miles I've driven. Why would the one on the plane loosen if it was installed properly. Again, just because the 1920s design Lyo-Conti-Saurus engines did it doesnt make it gospel.

I agree with that 100%. Aircraft engines may potentially be subjected to more movement & vibration than an auto engine, but when was the last time you could remove a properly installed oil filter from a car or an airplane without a wrench?

A story -
Back in the 90's I designed & built an engine mounted spin-on filter adapter for my Lycoming to replace its filter screen housing, that oriented the filter vertically for clearance and clean filter changes. At that time there was nothing available like it on the market. Started out using Porsche filters because they were cheaper & had greater filter surface area than the Champion aircraft filters at the time. Plus, they had a built-in bypass check valve, which those early aircraft filters did not - it had to be built into the filter adapter. They were designed for very similar flow rates to what the Lycoming requires - many auto filters were not. In choosing a filter, I built a pressure test rig from an old grease gun & tested many brands of oil filters to destruction. Quality of construction, shell wall thickness, filter surface area, etc. varied widely. I clamp the filter to the housing structure with a hose clamp, but it was designed that way to make other people who saw it feel good. I now use K&N filters, and due to that previous experience I developed a real prejudice towards certain brands, and a respect for oil filter design. I would not deviate from Rotax's recommendations carelessly.

Like others have said or implied, I think of oil filters & oil as relatively inexpensive "parts" compared to the precious engine, and I want the best. Rotax genuine filters may indeed be the best, or maybe not. Their previous design was obviously not "the best". I'd like to learn as much as I can about the Tempest filters, but I'll happily use Rotax for now.:)

[Dick B in KY]

Again, what bad things have been said about the Tempest filters????

Dick B

[Wheels]

I took this off another forum. It came from an IRMT who has more experience than I"ll ever have with Rotax Roger Lee. I don't think I violated any rules here but this should answer the mail.

"You actually have three types of valves so to speak. This is what makes the Rotax filter so unique and different from most auto filters and why you should just use the Rotax filter. One is the white anti drain back valve membrane that covers the small holes around the base. This was changed years ago too to make it more effective. Another is the bypass pressure diiferentail spring type on top of the filter and this is for the clogged filter bypass. Most auto filters bypass between 13-15 psi and I believe the Rotax filter bypasses between 18-22 psi. If this was ever actually activated you're way past a serious problem. Rotax years ago increased this spring bypass pressure because sometimes on a cold start the spring could open and allow so unfiltered oil to pass. If you are using a cheaper oil filter or auto filter you are most likely bypassing unfiltered oil at times during a start. For this bypass to work there must be a differential pressure between the upstream oil flow and the downstream oil flow. The last is the internal check valve that you can see looking into the filer. This helps stop oil filter drain that might cause oil to seep into the cylinders. The oil tank has a specific height relationship to be mounted with the engine. Aircraft like Kitfox mounted the tank too high which would cause oil to weep back towards the cylinders which in the early days could cause hydro lock.


p.s.
Don't use cheaper oil filters trying to save $5. Pay now or pay later and later may be a whole lot more expensive.

[Dave S]

Wheels,

Your mention of the bypass pressure is something that is seldom discussed; however, that is at the heart of the Rotax 912 warm-up procedure - i.e. allowing the oil to warm up to at least a minimum temperature before applying full power. The procedure is required to assure the oil is thin enough to prevent the bypass from opening and allowing unfiltered oil through at full power/max RPM. What I am getting at is the need to know that the bypass pressure of the Tempest (along with other parameters) is indeed equivalent to the Rotax filter. Another fly in the ointment is the filter media density/area has a direct impact on what oil temperature will be necessary to prevent oil bypass at full power - in other words a "looser" filter could get by with a lower oil temp but a "tighter" filter may require a higher temperature. Rotax should have this all thought out when they recommend certain oils with their engines as thinning gradients are not necessarily identical on different oils either.

I think it's great to have new products and experiment with them. In the case of the Tempest filter - it would be great if we could understand each engineering parameter and know it is equivalent. That's going to be hard to get as companies pretty much keep that to themselves.

Many times actual performance experience, good or bad, will not be available until after many people have used a product for a while. I keep recalling that bit of wisdom in investigative science..." The absence of evidence does not constitute the evidence of absence - you just haven't found it yet".