Radiator hose routing on 912iS (left side)

[ejoern]

Hello, I am installing a 912is and am trying to figure out the best routing for the radiator hose on the left side. It seems that the hose coming out of the engine can either go very close to the exhaust or route behind the ring mount. In both cases, it seems hard to get the proper routing to the radiator. Does anyone have any good pics on how the routing can be done? Thanks, Eric

[rosslr]

HI Eric,

I know what you are talking about - it gave me some angst too. I ended up coming between the ring mount and the exhaust, covering it all in good fire proof/heat shield and tying it back tot he ring mount with stainless steel cable tie. The gives a good inch clearance between the exhaust and the covered hose. It was stayed put for 170hrs now and shows no sign of heat affecting the heat shield. I did try running it between the ring mount and engine but too much opportunity for chaff there I thought. I don't have a pic with me at the moment - can take one when next down the hanger if nobody else chimes in. Just make sure to protect the rig mount from wear from the SS cable tie.

cheers

r

[jrevens]

That has bugged me too. I've had a couple of issues with radiators (somewhat because I'm just too darn fussy), and I'm having a custom aluminum radiator built with the inlet coming out the back of the radiator tank. I think It'll be a much cleaner installation with the hose routed through an area where there is not a lot going on instead of so close to the exhaust pipe, carburetor, etc. I'll try to post pictures if it works out. I'm also using all silicone hose for the radiator & heater circuit - I know that there are some guys out there who are just shaking their heads now, but when I build something, especially an airplane, I have to be really satisfied with it - just the way I am. I get a lot of satisfaction from the whole build process. That, and flying my Thorp helps me to keep my sanity! :)

[ejoern]

Thanks Ross and John! I think your idea Ross with the heat shield and SS tie wrap will be the way I go. Also, I have a couple other questions that have come up. One, the FWF kit instructions have you attach a #6 ground wire to the back of the engine block via a threaded hole, but it does not seem to supply the bolt/washer for that. Did your kit come with it? Second question is about the exhaust pipe. The instructions say that the Rotax (which I have) exhaust may protrude into the side of the cowl & implies that you could shorten it a bit if needed. Did you do that & if so did you have to relocate the spring attach weldment?

Thanks!

Eric

[rosslr]

G'day Eric,

No, I didn't find a bolt for the 6# wire and chose to ground it in a more convenient spot where I could easily inspect it for being tight. I think it was a M6 bolt needed from memory but don't take my word for that! I will take a pic later today when I go down the hanger.

As for the exhaust - no, I didn't shorten the exhaust. I think there is a thread on this site about just that but I concluded that it was best to keep it long and direct the hot exhaust away from the fabric and paint. However, I think a lot of guys have shortened it and/or raked it back as well.

How are you going with the wiring of the 912is Eric? Now that was a good challenge!

cheers

r

[jrevens]

Thanks Ross and John! I think your idea Ross with the heat shield and SS tie wrap will be the way I go. Also, I have a couple other questions that have come up. One, the FWF kit instructions have you attach a #6 ground wire to the back of the engine block via a threaded hole, but it does not seem to supply the bolt/washer for that. Did your kit come with it? ...

Eric,
I brought the #6 ground wire to one of the tabs on the back of the H.D. starter. That (body of the starter) is where the heavy current flows, and that is also directly connected to the engine of course. That is where they connect the engine ground on the S-19 Rans. I brought a much smaller wire/jumper (#14) from there up to the hole on the cylinder just for the heck of it, so the important ground for the ignition system has 2 connection paths at the engine. That threaded hole is indeed 6 mm. I got a bolt at my local Ace Hardware.

[ejoern]

Thanks again John and Ross! Very helpful. Ross, I have only completed (or nearly completed) the #6 wires on the engine side. I know there is plenty more in front of me for this engine. I have installed the engine fuse box, ECU (behind panel) and the solenoids & battery. I have not started the panel yet. If you want to send me any lessons learned for the 912Is, that would be fantastic!

Eric

[rosslr]

Hey Eric

here are some pics of the hose and the earth wire.

this shows the earth attach from the top- note that it is on the cylinder and just under the air filter. Next one shows from below.

11503
11504

this shows the hose route - it doesnt look like there is much room between the exhaust and the hose but there is about 11/4". Note 2 stainless ties, heat/fire proof cover. Ties go around the ring mount frame which is protected from the SS ties with some hose.

11505

I found the FWF wiring easy. It was marrying the Lane A and Lane 4 cables to my avionics and EMS plus the house system that tested my (limited) electrical skills! Getting my head around the starting system was probably the hardest - it took me a while to realise that when they were talking about a 'backup battery switch' they were not talking about connecting a back-up battery but a switch that you could flick to power the system in the case of all else failing! - a pretty unlikely event given that everything is doubled up.

anyway, best wishes with it and happy to share anything else if you need it.

cheers

ross

[ejoern]

Thanks Ross! These pics are very helpful.

Eric

[JoeRuscito]

I’m running into this same issue. I’d like to mount it as some have between the exhaust and the ring mount but if I bend the Rotax hose in that way it runs against the temp sensor.

I found a pre-bent hose that might work at the auto parts store. I’m hesitant for a couple reasons...the main one being how far back I have to cut the Rotax hose to make it work.

Thoughts on using a pre formed auto hose? https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190706/af1f48ae2eed6e4718ad74d9b6b57579.jpg


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[Cherrybark]

Seems there are several of us near the same stage of the build. I'm just completing the 912is wiring - the individual wires that is. I wrapped up this evening's work after managing to get the HIC connectors fed through the firewall. I'll suggest feeding these large connectors and harnesses before running individual wires such as the Start / Backup Battery switch wires. Eventually the wires will be neatly bundled but, at this point, it's just a jumble of wires.

Nice to have a heads up on the radiator hose before I get to that point.

[efwd]

I believe I rectified the contact on the temp probe by securing the oil line with clamps or wire ties or something. Wire ties on the engine mount is ill advised from what I understand so I wrap sillicone self adhesive tape around the tubes first. Gives a wire tie something to grip on to.

[rosslr]

I made sure there was good fire proof/heat proof tube over the water house and used adel clap around the engine mount to provide a good base for tying the hose to. Although the hose ( r more specifically the fire hose) touched the EGT probe and it being close to the exhaust pipe, there was no issue in 500hrs operation.

cheers

ross

[JoeRuscito]

Thanks for the tip Ross and Eddie. Any chance you have some pictures? Im also wondering what is the best way to secure/protect from chafe tubes that cross and are close the the muffler exhaust? You will see where I mean on the left side of my engine.

Carl here are some more pictures of how I did the rest of mine. Maybe it will save you some head scratching. I routed the right side outside of the rear headed because I thought it was top tight behind as the manual seems to describe.

Also if anyone sees anything ill-advised let me know!

2268122682226832268422685

[tracstarr]

does anyone have some good final pics of how they ran the coolant hose here? I'm stuck trying to find the best solution.

[JoeRuscito]

This is what I ended up doing. Made the most sense to me. Everything else on my engine seemed too tight, high chafe risk, or too close to exhaust. My thinking here is at least I’m below the hottest part of the exhaust (heat rises right?!?) and shielded where it’s close. The cabin heater hose helps to secure the system and nothing touches anywhere. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190812/13279f620ecfc4a9872eacf245c0d8b0.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190812/97dffa5e48d88a12c11173e7c5b12609.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190812/823ff8416af3e3ae5b20e27f3ce2ce2c.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190812/36ece248e638fb004a98bcd26895a33f.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190812/254a19147a60907397723925463e8750.jpg


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[tracstarr]

Here's how I've started mine. Oil line will be attached to help hold everything in place. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190814/e1523777ac2fbf3973a3afe59756da20.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190814/b24130741ba85d1d9adcd15d49184193.jpg

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[Cherrybark]

Where do you buy the shiny insulation wrap shown in Joe's post #16? And how is it secured to the hoses.

I also be picking up a length of the orange 3/4" fireshield. Are only the fuel and oil lines covered?

[efwd]

Hi Carl, it is self adhesive and can be bought at AS&S among other places. I find it at speed shops and McFadden Dale hardware as well if those are around you. It isn't inexpensive. I Used it on the lower cowl to protect against the muffler and I put some around the spot that the stinger comes through. You may have leftover to wrap the hose if you chose to get enough to do the other spots. If you go to AS&S and search Heat Shield, you will see lots of stuff to use. The 1.5" wide tape seems reasonably priced.

[JoeRuscito]

Yup that is where I got it too and what I did exactly.

[JMH]

Carl, I bought a heat shield sleeve from LEAF. I think I bought 12 inches and sleeved the radiator hose from the heater hose intersection toward the top of the engine. I highly recommend protecting the hose. I had an issue during taxi tests, and burned a hole in the hose and had to replace it. This hose is easy to remove, but very difficult to get it back on. A sleeve may be easier installed than trying to wrap the hose in that tight space.

John

[Cherrybark]

I miss cut the fire sleeve when installing the high pressure fuel lines. A local industrial supply was a convenient place to buy a replacement and, since the stuff wasn't expensive, I casually tossed the cut pieces and started over. Today I noticed the "aircraft grade" numbers on the fire sleeve at AS&S and realized the local product wasn't the right stuff. So AS&S got an order for a few feet of fire sleeve (~$15/ft), some thermal wrap and a thermal mat to protect the lower cowling from the nearby exhaust. The high pressure fuel lines aren't going to simply slip off the fittings so I also purchased a length of high quality, Gates Barricade high pressure hose.

Really appreciate the information on this thread.

[Cherrybark]

I'm finally returning to installation of the oil cooler and radiator hoses on a 912iS with oil cooler. One of the first steps with the 912iS is to move the oil return port to the bottom, pilot side of the engine. Instructions and drawings in the Oil Cooler Installation section clearly show the return hose running from the top of the oil reservoir to a return line located at the front of the engine. After lots of head scratching, I'm concluding the Oil Cooler plumbing instructions are "general" and for the 912iS, the return line goes to the fitting on the bottom of the engine. Any comments?

[Cherrybark]

Looking at oil line plumbing, without the oil cooler, cleared up the issue. The oil line is show going to the bottom, pilot side of the engine where the fitting was relocated. I just needed to fret a bit and make this problem more difficult that it actually is. Probably because I really don't want to be shopping for new hoses if I cut these incorrectly!

[efwd]

Hey Carl, welcome back. Been wondering.

[Cherrybark]

Very happy the oil lines are installed. Those push to connect fittings are neat but are a royal pain when your only tools are a couple of oven mitts, a few drops of soap, and a pan of boiling water. The job looks neat when completed and the flame shield certainly has a clean fit.

I was careful to use a second wrench when tightening the fittings on the oil cooler and got them fairly snug. Even when tight, those two fittings can be wobbled a bit. Is this normal? Possible oil leak?

[Shadowrider]

On mine there was some movement. When under pressure they seal.

[efwd]

As you have undoubtedly heard, yesterday was not a good day to fly (VFR) here in Southern CA. I stayed home. Sorry Carl.

[Cherrybark]

Understood Eddie and thanks for the feedback Dustin.