Kitfox 3 582 starter replacement

[martinbguk]

Hi Guys

Came to the conclusion today after much testing that my starter needs replacing. I had a off aircraft battery attached (as the aircraft battery was suspect) showing 14 v constant. The solenoid was clicking and showing 14v getting through to the starter cable. The starter would either do nothing/ spin without moving the gear forward / engage starter gear and jog engine but not spin it. So we came to the conclusion that the starter is suspect. The electric starter has worked previously, albeit sometimes slowly. Last time the engine just wouldn't start and drained the battery.

So, how do I get the old starter out? The firewall has a box coming into the cockpit that is rivited together, so no access there. Do I really need to move the engine completely? or is there a trick?

I had a forum search but I couldn't find anything.
I've got a new rotax starter to go in but I was after advice before I go for it.

Thansk in advance

Martin (in a wet and windy :( UK)

[jrthomas]

My good friend handed me the keys to his model 2/582 a couple of years ago to keep and fly while I was building my model 4. The starter stopped working and yes, pulling the engine was the only way to get to it. The problem ended up being a broken cable terminal where it attached to the starter. It's really not such a big job, just a little time consuming. James Thomas

[martinbguk]

Hi James
Did you have to remove the engine completely? Or move it just enough?
Martin

[jrthomas]

I borrowed an engine hoist from another buddy and pulled it completely off. I don't think there would be enough "give" with all the hoses, wires and carb linkage attached. We removed the carbs and let them hang. While we had it off we checked everything out and fixed or replaced anything that looked like might be showing wear. It's not as bad as it looks. I like to tag stuff as it comes apart so there's no guess what goes to what when putting things back together. Colored zip ties work good, especially on wires. Good luck, James Thomas

[avidflyer]

I would say to make sure you are getting a good ground to the starter. There are rubber o rings around the starter mounting bolts so it can wiggle a bit and that can mess with the ground if you don't have a separate ground strap between the starter and the airplane. Also, when you tighten up the starter, you don't want to tighten it up tight. That will cause the plate the starter bolts to to break. I think the spaceing between the starter and the plate is .040" but make sure to check. Jim Chuk
PS sorry if you already know about the spacing, but I broke things because I didn't know about it once.

[deejayel]

Drill out the rivets. Pull the starter. Then reattach the plate with pk screws.

[martinbguk]

Thanks for all your replies guys.
I'm up at the airfield tomorrow and will have a close look at each option.
I'll also practice hand propping her and if I can do that easily I'll postpone the state change until the annual in august.
I did also get a new starter for £110 which is sat on my desk ready for fitting.
Hopefully fly tomorrow in light winds.
MBG

[avidflyer]

It's not at all impossible to hand prop a 582. I did it lots of times with mine. You do have to flip it over pretty fast though for the ignition to produce spark. One hand on each blade, as close to the hub and still give you enough strength and leverage to flip it over. I know Dave Fischer has a video on Youtube of him doing it. He did it in the cold winter when it's a lot harder than on a warm engine. Jim Chuk

[Av8r3400]

Krazy Kitfoxer, Canadian Dave...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W867v6beoo4

[martinbguk]

Well, I got her started by using the two hand/two blade method.
Need better chocks.
But she did start. I also found that the oil pump cable was frayed and stuck at full throttle position so I changed that as well.
I'm favouring unzipping the panel behind the starter and pulling it out backward s. I'll just have to speak to my inspector to see what I need to do in the way of counter signatures.

[martinbguk]

UPDATE :
Pulled the engine today on a borrowed hoist.
Lifted up and wriggled just enough to get the old motor out and new one in.
All in all about 4 hours, some blood, lots of sweat, no tears.
Old stater is properly goosed.
New one turns the engine over well and the right way round which is a bonus.
I was kindly allowed hangar space as there were thunder storms today so I could work without getting wet.
Inspector counter signed engine going back in as I split the engine at the mounting frame to airframe. (5 bolts). 5th and last bolt was difficult to get back in but finally managed it.
Hoping to fly tomorrow.
Thanks for the advice
Martin