Cold Weather Ops

[Dick B in KY]

Ok all you 912ULS operators, I need some info. This is my first cold weather to be operating my 912ULS SuperSport in and need some info on how you operate yours for start up. Mine seems to be so cold natured that it will not run without being constantly choked for three to four minutes or more. Try to give it some throttle and it wants to die. Back off the throttle and keep the choke full out and it runs fine (2000 rpm or better). Is this normal (I hope not)?? Eventually it will get warm enough to accept some throttle and let the choke be released.
Let me know how your start process goes.

Thanks,
Dick B

[SkySteve]

I live in Utah. Yes, it gets mighty cold here at times. Here is what works best for me. First, I've added a primer to my system. Before I added the primer cold weather starts were difficult, as you have stated. Preheating the engine is a good place to start. You can add all kinds of on-engine engine warmers, you can blow hot air into the cowling, you can have a heated hanger. The best (read cheapest, easiest) way for me is to throw an old sleeping bag over the cowling, then hang a trouble light below the cowling, turn it on and go home. Or, just leave the sleeping bag and trouble light on all winter, you're not going to break the bank running one lightbulb. The next morning my engine is warm enough to start fairly easily. I first turn the engine over with the key for about 2 to 3 seconds with the mags OFF. Next, I close the throttle all the way and pump 4 pumps on the primer. Throttle still closed, choke on full, mags on, start. Open the throttle and run until warm (about 120 degrees oil temp) at 2,000 rpm. Works for me. I also block off the front of the oil cooler (the part that is exposed at the front cowl opening) with the silver metalic duct type tape.

[Dave S]

Hi Dick,

Like to think I am pretty good at freezing my tochous off trying to start things with gasoline engines up here :D

So here goes.

First off, I don't know that everyone has the same concept of "cold"

1) Anything down to 32-35 degrees F I do not preheat......a) do the rotax burp, b) close the throttle to the stops and then open it approximately 1/4 turn on the vernier (not much at all in case you are not using a vernier throttle....in any case, just enough to get it off the stops) c) Pull the choke & crank till it starts....usually starts right up within 2 -3 seconds. d) Modulate the choke for a few seconds, usually no more than 5 seconds when the temp is near freezing......if 50 or better, pretty much get off the choke right away e) adjust the throttle for 2000-2200 rpm to warm up.

2) Anthing colder than 32-35 F....I use a 1500 watt milk parlor electric heater rigged up with a plenum and 4" convoluted duct and plug that into the cowl below the prop. blanket on top of the cowl. Plug the side holes on each side of the prop and let that run for an hour +/- (if it's zero - runs an hour, if its 20-30 F run it half an hour to 45 minutes. After the preheat it starts like it would if 40-50 F outside).

I like to preheat when it is near freezing or colder just to be kind to the engine in the first place.

I have started the engine W/O preheat down to 15-20 F but it behaves much like you indicated (although I don't know what temp you are experiencing)

Any need to keep the choke out for quite a while after startup is not characteristic of my engine unless it is down to 15-20 F. With the preheat or warmer than freezing with no preheat...the choke does not need to be kept on hardly at all once it starts.

FYI - I have the rotax induction plenum installed with the air pickup in the NACA vent in front of the radiator - don't know if the induction plenum makes any difference on starting ot not....the airvalve provides an alternate air intake behind the engine but I start it on the normal cold air filtered intake in the NACA vent.

Sincerely,

Dave S
KF7 TRigear
912ULS, Warp Drive

[Slyfox]

this is what I have on mine. now I don't know what wattage I have, been to long. but I keep mine plugged in all the time. I go to fly, I unplug, fires right off. now the other day I didn't have it plugged in. was a little cold, like in the 30's and it farted and banged and broke my right side carb socket, oh and the throttle cable on the left side. learned my leason to keep it plugged in. it has a thermostate to shut it off when to a certain temp. you just need to read all the stuff. anyway this is what I have. I'm pretty sure I have the 150 watt.

http://www.reiffpreheat.com/Rotax912.htm

[DesertFox4]

The Reiff system is what John uses on the factory birds when pre-heating is needed.
My Arizona acclimated 912ULS does not enjoy starting much below 50 degrees. I do have the old style starter though and the newer high torque/speed starters might improve this.
There are days here that pre-heat on my particular engine would be beneficial. The Reiff system would be perfect. Problem at my over regulated airport is we can not leave anything plugged in and operating while not in the hangar. No heaters, appliances, tools, battery chargers ect.
Just the fridge.

[Dorsal]

Love my call ahead Aerotherm, call my plane a couple of hours before I fly and my oil temp is 90 at start.

[Dick B in KY]

Thanks for the replies, one and all. Seems like I'm going to have to get use to a cold natured engine and it's idiosyncrities, plus maybe install a heat system. By the way, my engine performs like this at any temp below about 65 degrees, must have something to do with the Kentucky air around here.

Dick B

[896tr]

Maybe give it a shot of Evan Williams.;)

[SkyPirate]

Hey Dick my engine starts really well in cold weather :) trade ya lol

[kmach]

Hi,

I use this method to start my 912 uls.

Throttle full off, choke/starting carb activated,engine fires up I disengage choke while advancing throttle to keep rpms at 2100 range.

This process changes little from summer to winter. I do preheat starting at around 50 F or less and the coldest I fly is around the - 5 F (- 15 C) .

The preheat is with a Reiff 150 watt system , and add an insulated cowl cover when the temp lowers .

I am a firm believer of preheating for engine longevity .

[n85ae]

Here's my solution, for my IO-240B (which HATES cold weather):

Cobbled space heater with dryer vent hose stuck in the cowl. I usually leave it run with thermostat
set on low in the hangar. This is the best solution and
I get oil temp almost as soon as I start the engine

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200613983_200613983?cm_mmc=Google-pla-_-Heaters%2C%20Stoves%20%2B%20Fireplaces-_-Electric%20Heaters-_-27828&ci_src=17588969&ci_sku=27828&gclid=CJnwxfKnvLoCFelAMgodlC8AXQ


If I don't leave it running, then it will get the IO-240B up to starting temp
even down to zero degree temps in about an hour of preheat.

I also have high current quick connect fitting on the passenger side by
the instrument panel and drop an old car battery with matching quick
connect on the passenger side floor for initial start on cold days. I have
an odyssey PC680, but the IO-240 can really stress it in cold weather.
The car battery gets it cranking almost like a car engine in cold weather.

Usually I don't need the battery though if the engine is well preheated.

I flew a Diamond a year or so ago in winter with an IO-240, and it was
nearly impossible to start it's IO-240 in the cold. I could probably hand prop
it faster than the starter rolled. This was on a 20 something day.

[Paul Z]

I started my engine when it was 18 Degrees outside without a heated. When I did the Oil pressure was very high. It seemed to take forever for the engine to warm up, I wouldn’t increase RPM over 1800 to protect the engine, put on the Carb Heat to pump the Exhaust heat back into the engine. I Really didn’t like doing it, but at the time I didn’t have a heater at the airport.

I was thinking of Cobbling together a space heater with some 4 inch ducting, but being in Texas it is more than I need. I decided to use an old used Hair Drier, and I bought a large diameter shop vac hose, and a little duct tape. I have a 2” X 6” Heat Strip on the bottom of my Oil Cooler. It works great. In fact the Hair Drier is actually more then enough. I am going to try opening the Oil Access Door and sticking the Hose in there, that way it will blow directly on the Oil Tank. I would bet that will speed up the process.

[Slyfox]

I found that the best way to start my 912uls may be a bit different.

when I first got my engine and tried to start it, it would buck like crazy. I believe there is a soft start thing out there.

But o stevie has to find another way.

I have my idle down to where it will shut off the engine. I've done it at 500rpm. so that will work also. No I don't let the engine buck and fart that low. I just maintain 1800 normally.

My reason for such a low idle helps for starting, shutting down, and dropping out of the sky and having engine braking:D

for the starting what I will do is turn off the mags(I have separate switches from the start switch. I pull the choke. than I crank the engine with mags off and count to about 3, like 1000 1 and so forth. than I will keep the idle off and turn on the mags. now I will hit the starter, sometimes it will kick, I let it, than I slowly raise the idle and it purs like a kitty.

what I do. works for me.

Oh and I preheat the engine under 65 degrees. I leave it on 24/7 thinks it's summer that way

[Av8r3400]

Careful with the hair dryer and plastic vacuum hose idea. That looks like a fire looking for a place to happen.

Up here where it's actually cold (Do you really preheat at 65°? that's summer for us... :rolleyes: ) I use a small "cube heater (http://content.westmarine.com/images/catalog/large/12858122.jpg)". I rigged it up on the top of an old work light stand and let it blow through the front opening of the cowl. There is a safety over heat protection in the heater so it shuts off if it gets too hot. I put a blanket over the cowl to contain the heat. With this on at 10°F outside, I can be ready to go after an hour of heating, with an oil temp of 70° or better.

[cubtractor]

I use the cube heater and some dryer duct. The temp can be adjusted to whatever you need. I use a light timer so it kicks on about 2 or 3 hours before I go.

[n85ae]

Only problem with hairdryers are they burn out fast. I've used up several
during fiberglass projects the typical milkhouse heater seems to last longer.
The hairdryer idea has appeal though for compact size though.

[SkyPirate]

question..ok after seeing cubtractors pre heater,,how many are going to copy?? ( as I raise both hands) :)

[Paul Z]

I use it for about 30 minutes while I preflight the plane in the hanger, I can watch it. The whole time, I plan on changing it to dryer duct. I was trying it to see if it works.


Careful with the hair dryer and plastic vacuum hose idea. That looks like a fire looking for a place to happen.

Up here where it's actually cold (Do you really preheat at 65°? that's summer for us... :rolleyes: )

[Av8r3400]

No ducts. Easy-Peasy…

[Olle1975]

I fix a heater (air 2000w) behind my watercooler (582). The hot air flow through the cooler and after that inside the cowling. After 30 minutes all watertubes (rubber & brass) are more than handwarm. After 45 Minutes the brass are hot.

Olaf

[n85ae]

You're joking right, 65F? I preheat below freezing. There's no point to preheat
above that ... If you really want to preheat I suggest moving up North, then it
will have some meaning ...

Regards,
Jeff


Oh and I preheat the engine under 65 degrees. I leave it on 24/7 thinks it's summer that way

[Slyfox]

really. where do you think I am. just other day I woke up to -5.

I preheat below 65 in both my planes. I want the best out of my engines and they start so nice when plugged in. You guys can have your portable heater and hoses. too much work and you have to worry about the units that are used not sparking out and cause a fire. been there with a hair dryer by the way. was in my house, but luckily I was home at the time when the hair dryer, just setting on the counter NOT working started sparking out at the control switch on the unit.

I like my setup. I pull up to the hangar, remove the cord, pull out the plane, start it(real nice start). by the time I get to the runway I pull on the runway and go fly, no long extended warm ups. I have to many things in my life to do. I don't need to be messing with the airplane for warm ups and preheats.

even back in my youth, if I went fishing, snowmobiling. anything, if it wasn't easy without hassle, I didn't want to do it. same with the plane. I have two hangars. I don't want one big one. much easier to just open the doors, pull out the plane and go fly. total time from when I get to the plane. 5 minutes and I'm generally in the air. for me convenience is everything.

[n85ae]

I just read the 65 degree comment, and from somebody else's post had Texas
stuck in my mind.

I have a milkhouse heater with an aluminum dryer vent hose.
It's bungeed to a small step ladder. I plug it in, and stick the hose into my
oil access door and walk out. It's been running all winter like that. I set the thermostat to trip somewhere between 30-40F in the hangar. This results
is a warm to the touch, but not hot engine all winter.

When the weather is typically above freezing (say 40+) I don't preheat. I
run 15W50 Aeroshell, and while it cranks a bit slow in cold(er) weather it
starts up, and I give it a decent warm up at idle before taxi.

Below freezing my engine (IO-240B) is pretty much impossible to start
without preheat.

Regards,
Jeff

[Slyfox]

I find that if I don't use the heat under 65 then it's harder to start, this is the 912uls. even the rv with the IO360 has trouble with heating up after start. I don't like to waste time or money on gas. for every minute I sit at the end of the runway waiting for the oil to heat up I'm burning fuel. The kitfox just hates the cold weather on start up. when I heat the engine under that it's just a flip of the switch and I'm gone. I even plug in my truck when things get cold. Like I said, I go for convenience. I just plug the cord into the front of the engine. I don't cover it or nothing. just plug it in. how easy is that. when I go to fly I unplug, pull out the plane and jump in and go. I have my own hangar, it's a t hangar. I always stop by the hangar and check out both airplanes for fuel and look em over. unless the little artesians have messed with my airplane:D(joke) than the plane should be as I left it. when time is tight when I go to fly, I don't have to do nothing but jump inside and go. sure I always eye the plane to make sure the tires are fine and stuff like that.

plugging the plane in a 65 doesn't hurt nothing but sure makes start up and warm up a nothing event. I have it, why not use it.

[Esser]

Rule of thumb for me is 5C which is right around 40F

[Slyfox]

I don't think experimental has anything to do with this. My neighbor has a 210 lots of money in it. fly's ifr has balloons on the wings heaters on the prop. 540W in the panel with an expensive auto pilot. yet he puts a light bulb in the engine area. why not the cylinder wraps and block heater like I have. He wraps the whole outside of the engine area. spends the money for that, but not on the actual heater for the engine. don't get it. oh well back to work:confused:

[Paul Z]

How many leave their planes plugged in over night. I have been very reluctant to do that mainly because I use the hairdryer. Being from Texas I was really having problems justifying buying something better. However, When it is below 50 Degrees I must admit it takes forever to warm up the engine. I duct tape the Oil Cooler to block 75% of the airflow, but I am then worked about having it over heat. I have been thinking of getting a Reiff PreHeat System for the same reason Slyfox posted “I don’t like to waste time or money on gas. for every minute I sit at the end of the runway waiting for the oil to heat up I’m burning fuel." The day it was in the 20s, it took almost 45 minutes to get the temperature up to 120 Degrees so I could fly.


I find that if I don’t use the heat under 65 then it’s harder to start, this is the 912uls...

[Esser]

The owner of the Cherokee i fly is an AME (A&P for you southerners) and he says only to preheat for a few hours before you go flying and that preheating all the time isn't good for the engine either. Why this is I don't know but I will ask him next time I see him

[Dorsal]

I use an Aerotherm, pricey but very nice, usually call it the night before and fly in the morning.

[Paul Z]

It looks like the Duce, since it is square, a lot more reasonable price then the “Aliens”. They are proud of their heaters. What is the small white brick on the floor by the cord on the floor? Do you use a timer or leave it plugged in all the time?

[n85ae]

This only has to do with oil sump pad heaters - hot oil, and cold upstairs
in the engine - when the water in the oil is evaporated it condenses upstairs
and you get rust. Not an issue if you heat the entire engine compartment,
or the entire engine (i.e. cylinder band heaters in addition to the sump)

Jeff


The owner of the Cherokee i fly is an AME (A&P for you southerners) and he says only to preheat for a few hours before you go flying and that preheating all the time isn't good for the engine either. Why this is I don't know but I will ask him next time I see him

[jiott]

That sure is a beautiful color scheme Dorsal. I have admired it ever since I first logged in on this forum.

[Dorsal]

Thanks Jim :)

Paul,
The little white box is a cell switch, turns on the heater when I call it.

[Slyfox]

This only has to do with oil sump pad heaters -...

I don't know. I check my engine all the time here when checking the oil and on annual. I have not seen any rust or condensation in the oil cap nothing, all looks normal on my plane. I guess if you have that problem, you can always stop. me, I have no issues with what I'm doing.

another thing I do, the kitfox I don't, but the rv I loosen the dip stick and leave the oil door open. never had an issue with condensation or rust in that engine. maybe it's because I fly 300+ hrs a year between the two.

[Slyfox]

Thanks Jim :)

Paul,
The little white box is a cell switch, turns on the heater when I call it.

doesn't that work where you have a sim card in the unit and have to keep it up like a cell phone, with monthly charge, like 10 dollars a month. just curious.

[Dorsal]

Sort of, $10 every 3 months which I don't pay in the summer so $20-30 per year. Oil, coolant, battery and the entire engine at 90 deg when I get there, nice rig but not the cheapest option.

[Paul Z]

Dorsal, how much is the service for the cell switch? I do not feel comfortable leaving a heater plugged in overnight running, with my luck I would go out to the airport to find the plane burned to the ground. I am contemplating getting something, I don't fly much in the winter because it takes so long to warm up. I was thinking of the Reiff Sstem it weighs little to nothing, cost a lot less, and I could order the cell switch. I would imagine that would suffice for Texas. Any thoughts on the subject?

[n85ae]

There's some talk about it in this article, whether or not a problem will
really occur ...?

http://www.avweb.com/news/maint/182846-1.html?redirected=1



I don't know. I check my engine all the time here when checking the oil and on annual. I have not seen any rust or condensation in the oil cap nothing, all looks normal...

[Dorsal]

Paul, About $20-30 year, Reiff even sells a version for their systems.

[Paul Z]

The big advantage I see with the Reiff is that it is always available, price is about 1/2 of an Aerotherm, and the Aerotherm will end up left at the hanger because I fly a SLSA. The downside the Aerotherm will do a lot better job soaking the engine! I am the type that doesn’t want to sit around and wait for it to heat up.

[Dorsal]

Aerotherm also works with any plane and therefor should keep it's resale value (if that is of any concern). My wife got me the whole setup as a Christmass preasent a few years back, good women :D

[n85ae]

I have a Reiff system on my engine, BUT I don't use it except rarely ... I
prefer the milkhouse heater via dryer duct. It keeps the engine nice and
warm but not hot and I don't fret about baking something like I do if I
leave the Reiff system plugged in. If I'm in a hurry to preheat and it's all
cold I plug everything in and hope the hangar breaker doesn't pop.

Regards,
Jeff

[Flybyjim]

perhaps I missed this, where do you get the cell switch?

[Paul Z]

Both Aerotherm and Reiff sell them.
Reiff’s is less expensive.

perhaps I missed this, where do you get the cell switch?

Here is a you tube on the Aerotherm Remote Cell Phone Relay.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8t6CsfYFRA

[Paul Z]

Well I bought a good Space Heater to Pre-Heat my plane. I can’t justify a Aerotherm heater just a little pricey considering I might use it 10 times in a year. Dallas just normally doesn’t get that cold. However, I like the idea of using a heater under 40 degrees to reduce my time sitting on the tarmac waiting for it to warm up. I am planning on getting one of the Cell Phone Switches, that way I can turn it on when I leave for the airport, and by the time I get there it will be ready to fly. Any recommendations? GSM makes a switch, Aerotherm sell the RCS & RCS2, Switchbox makes one. Any recommendations????

[jiott]

I beleive Sporty's also sells one.

[jiott]

This question is more related to damp, rainy weather. I am in an uninsulated, unheated hangar where I know the humidity is very high in damp rainy Portland weather. I am already noticing a few unplated, unpainted steel hardware starting to develop some rust.

What are your suggestions? There is power available and I have thought of running a 75 watt light bulb continuously in the cockpit near the floor with the doors closed. Is it safe? Will it make enough heat to keep the humidity down?

[Paul Z]

Looking at the Cell Switches I have found. In trying to do a comparison, the Switchbox looks like the best value to me 2 outlets, and 15 Amps. What do y’all think? Does anyone have a Switchbox?

Switchbox : $299, 2 Outlets, 120V / 15 Amps, Activation via: Cell Phone, App, or Text Message http://switchboxcontrol.com/the-switch-box/

Aerotherm RCS: $299, 2 Outlets , 120 V / ?? Amps, 1,800 Watts, Activation via: Cell Phone, or Text Message
http://aerothermheaters.com/products/rcs

Aerotherm RCS2: $399, 1 Outlets , 120 V / ?? Amps, 2,100 WattsActivation via: Text On/Off Message
http://aerothermheaters.com/products/rcs2

Sporty’s Cell Switch: $295, 2 Outlets , 120 V / 10 Amps, Activation via: Cell Phone, or Text Message
http://www.sportys.com/PilotShop/product/16850

Reiff GSM Cellular Remote: $189, 1 Outlets , 120 V / ?? Amps, 1,800 Watts, Activation via: Cell Phone On/Off,
http://www.reiffpreheat.com/GSM-SWITCH.htm

[Esser]

A bit cheaper option....if it works as advertised:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-110V-220V-3-Sockets-Power-Outlet-Cell-Phone-GSM-Remote-Control-Smart-Switch-/181276725878


If you have wifi in your hangar this would work too.
http://www.amazon.com/Belkin-Automation-Switch-Discontinued-manufacturer/dp/B0089WFPRO/ref=pd_sim_sbs_hi_9

[n85ae]

My milkhouse heater has been running all winter non-stop ... Thermostat set
to trip around 40F in the hangar. Never have to call it to wake it up, it's cheap,
it's easy, and it doesn't need cellular service either :)

Spent under $50 for the heater and ALL the ducting, have been using it for
over 5 years on my plane, and PREFER it over my complete Reiff system which
is installed on my engine (pad heater plus bands)

Cheaper is better!

Jeff

[n85ae]

Here's my first heater. It's an El-Cheapo plastic one, but it lasted about 5
seasons. My current one is a metal cased heater, and more the "deluxe" model.
As far as how well they work though, both work great.

As you can see I have a fairly long duct on it, so EVEN if the heater burst into
flames (highly unlikely since it has a built-in thermal fuse) my plane is still safe.

With these heaters, I see initial oil temp reading (100F) within minutes
of engine start. Even with 0F outside air temp.

Jeff

[Esser]

I think you have to be a site sponsor to post for your own company info. Not trying to rat you out. I just want to let you know for future :)

[jiott]

This question is more related to damp, rainy weather...

Anybody have any thoughts on this?

[n85ae]

Bulb seems reasonable, EXCEPT my plane has the plastic header, and despite
no leaks it does smell fuelly in there ... So I would be a bit nervous about it.

Snap...Crackle....Pop...BOOM!!!! If you know what I mean.

Regards,
Jeff

[Danzer1]

Thoughts on Jim's question:

Adding heat does not change the absolute humidity level - just the relative humidity percentage in the air. Like a sponge - double the size of the sponge and it can hold twice as much water (difference between 50 and 100%). Same with the air - heat the air and it can hold more water.

So adding heat will keep the water in the air longer and keep the condensation from forming on any part that is also warmer than the outside air. Remove the heat and you are back to square one.

I would not be a fan of any heating source that does not have a thermal safety and is also operated to cut off when it reaches a set temperature. Unless of course you are going to stand there and watch it!:)

The only thing that will actually remove water from air is a dehumidifier or air conditioner (as a byproduct of it's function).

Greg

[Danzer1]

As this thread seems to have a lot of interest, I'm going to add a few thoughts to ponder:

The Aerotherm (a fan, not an endorsement) is efficient because it has an inlet and outlet ducted to the engine compartment, so the air is recirculated and stays hotter, therefore heating the engine faster.

Most of what I see here are heaters open to the hangar on the inlet side. SO effectively, you are heating your hangar through your engine compartment and it is very inefficient.

As an example, lets say your hangar is at 20F and you want 120f in the engine compartment. The blower is sucking in 20f air constantly and has only a certain temperature rise, based on the cfm airflow and wattage of the heating element. Lets say that's 80f rise. So if you have 20 coming in you'll only get 100 out. Plus that heated air is exiting the engine compartment back into the 20F hangar. Eventually you will get the hangar to heat up too, but that's a lot of wasted energy.

With a return, back to the inlet side, you would probably get 150F (or more) out and 110F (or more) back in the return (accounting for the leakage and actual heating of the engine). So it's going to work a hell of a lot faster and use a lot less energy and time to do it.

Again, I wouldn't use anything (unattended) unless it has a thermal overload and also has a thermostat control to shut it off at a preset temperature.

It would be nice you could tie it into the oil and or water temp sensor and set the high level from there.

Greg

[Paul Z]

Greg,

I concur with your evaluation, but there is an assumption that they plug all it openings. The cost of the Aerotherm is prohibitive. The least expensive one I could buy 10 Space Heaters.

Paul

[Danzer1]

I understand the initial cost factor. I am suggesting the method is far superior, not the initial cost or the product itself. That said, if you factor in what it costs to heat your hangar through your engine compartment, over time, even the Aerotherm wins! How about a ducted return to the inlet of some of the space heater ideas we've seen? That's the idea I'm trying to get across.

Greg

[n85ae]

This was what I was trying to do in addition to heat the engine, but the
hangar is still too cold!!! So I think I'll get a bigger heater! :)

Actually this is an example of over thinking something at the computer. If
I go out to the hangar right now it's about 5F outside right now, and I stick
my hand in the cowl the engine will be warm to the touch, if I crank it up
it will start right away, and I'll have 100+ oil temp in just a few minutes and
be ready to fly.

Yeah the closed loop systems work well, but they're just a better mousetrap...
The simple milkhouse version still kills mice, and for a lot less money.
Of course in aviation everybody likes to spend more money so why
should I try to discourage it ...



Most of what I see here are heaters open to the hangar on the inlet side. SO effectively, you are heating your hangar through your engine compartment and it is very inefficient.

[War Eagle]

[quote=Esser;37618]A bit cheaper option....if it works as advertised:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-110V-220V-3-Sockets-Power-Outlet-Cell-Phone-GSM-Remote-Control-Smart-Switch-/181276725878

Nice find.http://www.teamkitfox.com/Forums/images/icons/icon14.gif

Also interested if anyone has used this particular unit and how does it work for you.

[Paul Z]

I actually purchase a Space heater, that I believe I will be able to install an input air and output air hose, very much like the Aerotherm. If it works I will post pictures of it.


I understand the initial cost factor. I am suggesting the method is far superior, ...Greg

[ackselle]

I'm using the Belkin WEMO switch (link = http://www.belkin.com/us/p/P-F7C027/ ). It uses your wireless network, and you can control the switch from anywhere in the world...so long as you have internet.

http://www.belkin.com/images/productmt/522277/372.jpg
I've got one I use for the block heater on my tractor. Works VERY well!

[Paul Z]

Do you need WiFi at the airport, to make this work?

[ackselle]

Yes.... the Belkin needs WIFI. It works at my place as I have wifi in the hangar.... so it won't work at most airports.

[Paul Z]

I have a The SwitchBox, I originally had a 2G that worked flawlessly other than reloading the minutes. That was always a problem. The SwithBox offered an upgrade to a 4G, so I sent it in to get the Upgrade. That was the biggest mistake. When I go it back I called the number and called the number (718) 483-6979. It wouldn't turn on and it wouldn't turn off. I called Switchbox and I told him it was not working. I ended up mailing it back to him two or three time to get it fixed. He said it worked fine and sent it back and said I must be dialing the phone number wrong. Now Im 66 years old I've probably been dialing and keying in phone numbers longer than he has been alive. So I took offense to that. I would guess that the circuit isn't compatible with the G4 System in our area, or there is not a tower that supports the 4G system close enough to my airport or my home that works with the system, or the piece of junk just doesn't work. The owner of Switchbox was rather rude with me about my inability to dial a phone, so I asked him to send it back and I had a use for it. I really haven't decided what to do with it, but it's between putting it in the trash bin or taking it to the range and practice my shooting, and see how many times I can hit it. I'm leaning towards the latter.

My recommendations for all of the Kitfoxers, if you decide to get an Electronic Switch to turn on a heater, or battery charger, DON'T get The Switchbox! The man across from my hanger bought a generic one off of E-Bay for a lot less money, and his works flawlessly.

[efwd]

Yeh, that number is "not reachable".

[SkySteve]

I vote take it to the range, then send the "parts" back to the owner, via truck, freight collect.

[Paul Z]

The number use to reachable, I just did not recharge or add money. It never would switch after the upgrade.

[Paul Z]

I was thinking of taking it to the range, then wearing like a neckless around my neck at Oshkosh. I was also thinking of handing out a flyer, saying not to waiste your money on a SwitchBox.