Gross Weight

[Dick B in KY]

Hello All, Just wanted to see what everyone has for their Kitfox gross weight on the airworthiness cert.

Is it 1320 LSA weight or the normal 1550? Getting ready for my AW inspection on my SS and have to make a choice. Still have my medical, but thinking down the road a few years.

Dick B

[Dave S]

Hi Dick,

2008 Airworthiness Cert on our Series 7 is 1550:cool:

Sincerely,

Dave S

[AWainwright]

Still have my medical, but thinking down the road a few years.

Dick B

Remember, once it's certified one way you can not change it. Also, if you "fail" a medical then you need to go through the waiver/SODA process, if you just choose to let it expire, then you can use the driver's license medical for LSA, having the 1320 may make the "Let it expire" decision easier.

I'm in the process of buying a 1550# Kitfox, but will own an LSA version (either factory built, "me" built, or bought from another builder) within 2-3 years. I figure you can load to the 1320 and if the fuel gauges tell you that you have less gas than you actually do, if your passenger lies about his/her weight by 10 pounds, your uncalibrated bathroom scales read low, or you forget to pull that tool bag out from under the seat before loading for a trip, you have a nice 230# safety margin. You may not be legal, and I wouldn't suggest overloading intentionally (insurance void, and possible FAA violation), BUT... the airplane won't be complaining and you don't risk damaging anything. I certainly don't advocate chewing into safety margins, and would not overload one intentionally..... but how nice to have it! And with the Rotax powerplant and 1320 you have plenty of payload unless it's regularly 2 larger guys up front! (the 1550# Kitfox 6 I'm buying is a Lycoming powered airplane, therefore quite a bit heavier empty weight, so 1320 wouldn't work)

Hope that helps,
-Andrew

[avidflyer]

Actually, according to questions I asked of the local FSDO, gross weight can be changed (increased) by going back into the phase one process and proving it out. However, if one wants to fly the plane with a sport Pilot license, the plane can never have been registered above the 1320 lb weight limit and then later revised down to a lower gross weight to fly as a sport plane. Take care, Jim Chuk

[AWainwright]

Correct, however, if you ever, and I mean "EVER" operate the aircraft out of the LSA specs, e.g. register it over the LSA weight, add a constant speed prop, etc... then it can never be LSA ever again regardless of how it was originally certificated. Once it's "not" an LSA, it can "never" be an LSA again.

Note in the reg below the subtle, "Since its original certification, has continued to meet..." in the first sentence. That means forever and always. Once that's broken, it can't be an LSA. I was looking for the FAA ruling somewhere that said you can't convert an airplane for the specific purpose of meeting LSA rules, but can't find it. Basically they were giving guidance on this reg. Remember, read the regs to prove you WRONG, not to prove you right and you'll fall on the safe side of the ASIs :-)

Andrew, CFI, A&P

From 14CFR 1.1
Light-sport aircraft means an aircraft, other than a helicopter or powered-lift that, since its original certification, has continued to meet the following:

(1) A maximum takeoff weight of not more than—

(i) 1,320 pounds (600 kilograms) for aircraft not intended for operation on water; or

(ii) 1,430 pounds (650 kilograms) for an aircraft intended for operation on water.

(2) A maximum airspeed in level flight with maximum continuous power (VH ) of not more than 120 knots CAS under standard atmospheric conditions at sea level.

(3) A maximum never-exceed speed (VNE ) of not more than 120 knots CAS for a glider.

(4) A maximum stalling speed or minimum steady flight speed without the use of lift-enhancing devices (VS1 ) of not more than 45 knots CAS at the aircraft's maximum certificated takeoff weight and most critical center of gravity.

(5) A maximum seating capacity of no more than two persons, including the pilot.

(6) A single, reciprocating engine, if powered.

(7) A fixed or ground-adjustable propeller if a powered aircraft other than a powered glider.

(8) A fixed or feathering propeller system if a powered glider.

(9) A fixed-pitch, semi-rigid, teetering, two-blade rotor system, if a gyroplane.

(10) A nonpressurized cabin, if equipped with a cabin.

(11) Fixed landing gear, except for an aircraft intended for operation on water or a glider.

(12) Fixed or retractable landing gear, or a hull, for an aircraft intended for operation on water.

(13) Fixed or retractable landing gear for a glider.

[Av8r3400]

Also note that in the reg quoted above, no where is "Gross Weight" discussed. The weight limitation is "Maximum Takeoff Weight". This is not just semantics. As the builder you can set the MTO where ever you want. If you build your plane to the 1550# specs, you can still specify it to have the limited MTO to qualify for LSA. (From the beginning of it's operations, of course.)

[AWainwright]

Also correct, as long as it's never been above the 1320 take-off weight as registered. And yes, you could have a larger gross ramp weight (by a few pounds for taxi fuel), as long as max takeoff is 1320 or less.

Now.... if we could figure out a way to do in-flight refueling of a KitFox.... we could do like the old SR-71s and takeoff with minimal fuel, top off, then go! :D Maybe a Cessna 206 tanker for the fleet? :rolleyes: