Tail wheel pole

[foxkit3]

Hello, Just wondering What You tail wheel kitfox pilots perfer wheel landings or full stall 3 point ? I find myself wheel landing all the time now, Seems more natural to me, The peanut gallary at my airport seams to frown on wheel landings. Just can't figure out why.

Chris

[Av8r3400]

I full stall, 3-point about 90% of the time.

I prefer to get my tailwheel on the ground for control purposes. My model IV-1050 has a small rudder and on rollout of a wheel landing has little authority.

[Monocock]

The peanut gallary at my airport seams to frown on wheel landings.

Chris

What's a peanut gallery??!!:confused:

[WWhunter]

LOL...Peanut gallery normally refers to all the 'NUTS' that 'think' they are the authority and all -knowing people that always have something to say about someone or something. I also call them computer commandos since they seem to get all their answers from the internet, doesn't matter if the answers are right or wrong......but they read it on the internet so it must be true!!

[t j]

I land three point 99 percent of the time. Every once in a while I make a wheel landing just to make sure I still know how. I haven't figured out how to wheel land without using some power and or extra speed. To me it just seems like the extra speed at touch down isn't a good thing.

On the other hand, wheel landings do provide good practice and development of skill. The peanut gallery is most likely just jeallous.

[kmach]

Hi,
I wheel land 70% of the time on my dirt strip, I find it more difficult to three point especially if you are carrying too much speed at the thresh hold !

These birds do like to keep flying.

After more hours and practice , three points are easier, speed needs to be right for a nice short one, with no "hops". :)

[Slyfox]

the peanut crew. good one. I have them here also. My thought, do the wheel landings from now on, that's what I'd do, just to **** the pee nuts off.

[chetlongshooter]

Model 1 with HKS 700 E, 3 point works pretty well for me most of the time. The model 1 really likes to slow down and it so far is just natural to do a 3 point.

[kitfoxnick]

If I'm trying to get in short, I'll do a tail low landing. Get it slowed down to where you almost 3 pt and as the mains touch roll the plane up onto it's mains with stick forward. As soon as you go forward dump the flaps and get on the brakes. By doing this you decrease angle of attack, killing lift. Dumping the flaps also puts the weight on the wheels and allows for better braking. Best of all the increased visibility. As soon a the tail gets light it's time to get off the brakes. It's a busy few seconds but it's my recipe for getting in short.

[Agfoxflyer]

3 point 99%. I did my tailwheel training in a flight school that specialized in tailwheel training. They would not allow and would not teach wheel landings. Said too many dinged props. So I guess I'm not as comfortable doing wheel landings. Got to work on it though.

[foxkit3]

Seems like wheel landings are taboo or something. I found it is much easyer to land in a cross wind wheel landing. It is hard to train your brain to push the stick forward when landing. I found just hold it off as long as you can in ground effect, Once the tires touch push the stick alittle forward and work the rudder, Keep pushing the stick forward till the tail touches. My model 3 with a 912 up front seems to run out of elevator to do a nice 3 point

[DesertFox6]

WOW! The things you learn from your Fellow 'Fox Flyers: A tailwheel training operation that refused to teach wheel landings! What next? No wing-low crosswind landings in Cherokees because of scraped wingtips? (sigh)

Agfoxflyer, it appears as there's no shortage to the number of people still actively fighting mental health; you have my abject apologies on behalf of taildragger instructors dedicated to this art-form everywhere. In fact, It's neigh impossible to scrape a prop tip on a properly configured airframe/engine/prop setup owing to a lack of elevator authority and the fact that the wing has to be forced into a negative angle of attack. Assuming you're not landing at a cruise power setting and speed, you have to jump on the breaks while at a pretty good clip to generate the inertia needed to put the aircraft on its nose. Oddly enough this is pretty much why a lot of certified taildraggers retain the heel-brake setup; it's pretty hard to put one up on its spinner with heel brakes. Check in with the Legend Cub folks; they firmly believe what I just said!

As many of you know, and as foxkit3 mentions in the previous entry just below, wheel landings are the answer to cross-wind landing control problems by keeping the rudder up high where it's more effective for a longer period of time after the main gear has touched planet Earth. Wheel landings are also a great solution to landing on unfamiliar, narrow, strips where weed-wandering might prove unhealthful...providing landing distance isn't going to be a problem since, without brakes, you're gonna roll a bit farther down the strip with a wheel landing. More on this a bit later.

Three-points are favored by the vast majority of instructors (and certainly those who own their own training aids!) because of the lower landing speed allowed at the full-stall AOA and the attendant nose-control discipline involved. In short, one learns to control the machine properly, BY SIGHT, no slop allowed, from the first pass at the grass! Wheel landings should be introduced once the novice has demonstrated the ability to control airspeed and AOA in the flare repeatedly. Then they REALLY start to learn the fine art of tail-dragging! Discouraging this training smells of insurance-related problems or ignorance at best, and deliberate negligence at its worst: The FAA, and, I'm sure, Transport Canada, specifically REQUIRES this training pursuant to being issued a tailwheel endorsement: DUUH!

Three-point or two-point: One or the other? Not necessarily: do you HAVE to choose between parallel parking or nose-in/back-in? Shouldn't the parking space or runway you're confronted with dictate that decision at the appropriate time? I believe so; there are just as many good reasons to use one technique over the other DEPENDING on what the surface/slope/width/winds/obstacles/lunar influence on the tides are doing AT THE POINT OF INTENDED LANDING. The ability to select between the two types of landings or even combine elements of both when the situation dictates enhances the glory of being able fly a taildragger in the first place! ;)

To discourage wheel landings at the cost of losing the aircraft out of blind prejudice from the "peanut gallery" tells me these opinionated "nuts" really don't know what they're talking about: Just like children parroting their parents' prejudices without understanding them. This conundrum merely confirms my long-held suspicion that "blind prejudice" is just a PC term for "ignorance," but there's no place for either in aviation. Police blotters and NTSB reports are filled with those who refused to learn...as are cemeteries, sadly.

Kitfoxnick describes a great technique for a pilot who can handle the cockpit workload of combining elements of a three-point approach with the finesse of a visibility-enhancing wheel landing while keeping his mount under control by modifying his wing (flaps up!) and simultaneously adding judicious braking: This, I opine, is a demonstration of the "art" of tail-dragging; the ability to wield the brush strokes to "paint one on" the runway as opposed to blindly daubing paint-by-the-numbers! One size fits all. BLAH!

I encourage all taildragger pilots to seek out an EXPERIENCED instructor and sharpen your skills with a true mentor; you'll enjoy the artistry of your finished masterpiece ever so much more and never return to the mundane practice of drab, one-brush-fits-all, color-daubing again!

"E.T."
(Now where'd I put my water color set...?) :rolleyes:

[WWhunter]

If a place is avoiding teaching wheel landings I would walk away. That place has no business what so ever giving TW instruction! Not every flight ends with the conditions for 3-pointers. Like has been stated, in crosswind conditions I also prefer wheel landings brought in with a little speed to get things perfectly straight and have a little more control.
I think when I originally got my TW instruction it was a requirement by my instructor to demonstrate a 3-point and a wheel landing.

[foxkit3]

Guess I was lucky to have to Have a C.F.I that that focused on teaching me both Ways to land a tall wheel. He would not sign me off until I was proficient with both landing techniques. From what I have read I feel bad for someone getting tail wheel training and not being taught wheel landings.

[jdmcbean]

I would not solo a student that could not demonstrate both wheel landings and 3 point landings... period. Both have a place and time and many will argue when to use one or the other. Regardless, you should know how to do both.
Then practice crosswind techniques with single main and Tailwheel (2 point) or crosswind single main wheel landings... You may even be suprised how many botched 3 points turn into wheel and visa versa..

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