building doors

[jtpitkin06]

I’ve reached a decision point on the doors.

Quandary… should I pop rivet the door skins to the door frames or use PK screws?

Pop rivets are low maintenance. I’ve rarely had one break or fall out. However, when the time comes to replace the glass ( a certainty at some point) it’s a real pain drilling out all the rivets. There is also the issue of the old rivet residue rattling in the frame. The new door latch ferules are 1/4 inch so it might not be so hard to clean out the trash.

PK screws are simple to replace… But they do have a little habit of falling out. I think there is a sprite with a Phillips screwdriver lurking on every airport. Replacement of the glass is pretty easy if I use screws. As an added benefit you can control the tightness of the screw to prevent cracking the glass. That’s hard to control with pop rivets.

Being new to the Kitfox, I guess this is an informal survey to see what the regulars have done.

While on the doors, the build manual suggests 3M acrylic mounting tape as a seal or bond between the door frame and the skin. I’d appreciate any experience with this. The only time I’ve used it is to apply body moldings on a truck and getting it off later was an affair to remember.

John Pitkin
SS7 in build
Having a ball.

[War Eagle]

Don't know if you are building glass (bubble) doors or doors with half fiberglass and half acrylic.

Between 2001 and 2005 I have seen 12 sets of the half and half doors built. They were all installed with countersunk rivets and then the rivets were finished over with some various kinds of covering agent (i.e. bondo, feathering putty etc.) to make everything flush with the finish surface of the door and hiding the rivets. There was no 3M tape placed on the door frame for these installs. In a matter of a few years each of these door sets have shown cracking and flaking around the rivets. If fit and finish is important to you then you might want to recognize the possibility of seeing similar results of this install method.

On the glass (bubble) door installs (which there have been three) we used the 3M tape placed on the door frames and then placed the glass on the tape to secure it. Once the glass is in contact with the 3M tape you will have great difficulty if you didn't install in exactly like you wanted it and then need to reposition it. Ugh!! The tape will hold the door in place on the frame like a gorilla grip. Just for insurance we added a stainless screw (with an auto upholstery finish washer on the outside glass) through the door frame and then finished on the inside with a flat washer and nyloc nut on each side of the corners and on each side of the mid frame bend areas. This makes a total of 12 per each door. I will try to include a couple of pictures of the mid frame bend and a corner so you can see the detail. I will also include a picture of the whole door so you can see the 12 screw attachments as well as the 3M tape between the door frame and the glass.

[jtpitkin06]

War Eagle.

Thanks for the input. It's always good to see how others install things like glass on the doors.

I am installing bubble doors. They are standard on the SS7.
My wife does not like the idea of taxiing up with her crotch in full view so I have agreed to make some snap-in upholstery panels for the bottom of the doors.


I did notice from the pictures that the weather stripping is visible through the glass. It's something I had not thought about until now . No matter what color I paint the door frame, the door will still have a black outline unless I paint a trim strip on the outside. I'll have to rethink the paint scheme.

Tape does have a uniform appearance. If I were to use a sealant, it would look squished and smeary. But as you say, the tape is a bit tricky to get things aligned.

John Pitkin
Greenville, Texas
SS7 in build

[cap01]

captain john , just so you make the lower door window covers removable . i only have the half window in the doors and i made up interior panels with pockets for the lower half . when i attempt to fly with the door open , the fabric pockets want to catch the wind . so much for flying with the door open unless i remove the panel . the bubble doors should give a great view , unless you want to take pictures . its really difficult to get good picture account of the reflections in the plexiglas .

[jtpitkin06]

Absolutely, I'll keep the full bubble.

The plan is to have a snap-in/out panel for the inside bottom half of the door. It should tuck in nicely below the center brace. The panel will also provide a bit of insulation in the colder months for your leg and elbow. I'm not planning any pockets. It's too easy for stuff to fall out of gull wing door pockets.

John Pitkin
Greenville, Texas
SS7 in build.

[cap01]

i flew for awhile today with the left door removed , what a view . the bubble doors may have to be one of next winters project . got pretty chilly , will have to be a lot warmer than 70 degrees for me to try it again .
the snap in lower liner sounds like a great idea . although arriving with my crotch in full view has never been an issue for me . the seating arrangement for the model 7 must be a little different than in my 4 if arriving that way is a possibility ?

[hansedj]

Just to add a little, I did mine just like war eagle but I used rivnuts so there are no visible nuts on the inside of your door. My old doors (Lexon) were done with rivits and cracked around some of the rivits. You can find the 3m tape on ebay, I put the tape on (leave the backing on) and set door where you want it, then pull backing, like he said once it is stuck its stuck.

[cap01]

whats 3m acryilic mounting tape ? is it like a clear rug tape ?

[hansedj]

Here is the instructions I used the part number for the tape is there.

[cap01]

thanks dj . as crappy as the weather has been this spring and summer , i could have had some of next winter projects done by now . i think ill save the info and really attempt this one next winter .

[Dick B in KY]

Cap01, You can get the 3M acrylic tape at places like Car Quest- 1/2"X5yd roll for about $14.00. Used for attaching exterior trim and mouldings to autos. It really sticks, used it on my side doors and rear side windows with rivets.

Dick B

[cap01]

after dj posted the info about the doors and tape i did a little research on the tape . seems to be some pretty good stuff . thanks

[jtpitkin06]

By the way… if you ever need to remove the glass and tape is holding it down, just use dental floss. Place the floss between the glass and the tape and use a gentle sawing action. The floss will go through the tape like a wire through cheese without scratching your window. Then just rub and peel up the residue.



JP

[cap01]

the 3m literature suggests monofilament but if floss works all the better since i dont fish . the monofilament wouldnt work last winter when i was removing a wing tank . had to move up to .020 saftywire to cut the sealant that was holding the tank in