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49LOOPER
05-06-2010, 09:02 PM
I recently started my Rotec R2800 powered Kitfox IV Speedster for the first time. It started instantly and ran great! The Rotec experience has been very good so far and I'm looking forward to getting in the air here shortly. I purchased the Kitfox as a partially completed Classic IV Speedster back in August 2009. I used the Stewart covering system, which I highly recommend, especially if you are going to cover and paint in your garage. The Rotec people are very helpful, and I appreciated Joe meyere giving timely responses to my questions as our planes are much alike. I've attached a couple of photos of the project.

Pilot4Life
05-07-2010, 09:34 AM
49LOOPER,
What a nice looking engine. And sure to be a great looking plane when finished!! I am just in the beginning stages (C182 phase) of my FW training for the Army to finish in King Air Super 350s when said and done. I hope to link up at T82 soon after and spend some time talking shop. How was the Stewart Systems for covering? I read that you recommended it. I have watched just about every video I could find on YouTube that talks about fabric and now we've got a post here that proves it is a good system. Please continue to keep us updated and we wait with you in anticipation of that first flight. Until then...

PS. What does the cut-out in those chalks read?

49LOOPER
05-07-2010, 11:19 AM
Thanks Chris,
I learned about the Stewart System from the Flitzer (www.flitzerbiplane.com) website, where a couple of builders talked about how much they were pleased with it. I ordered the videos and ,after talking with Dan Stewart, ordered the materials. I have had very positive experiences with the Polyfiber System, but the requirement to cover and paint in my garage in a residential area (with a hoa too) lead me to the Stewart System. The Stewart System virtually does away with the need to clamp the fabric, pot life concerns with the glue and noxious, dangerous fumes. It made the covering process easy and enjoyable for me and I will use it on my next project. I still have to paint the fiberglass and metal though, so I'll let you know how that goes.
The wheel chocks were a gag gift from a friend for the Kitfox, and they say "Belchfire 8". This is the 8th plane I've owned in my life, and the previous one was referred to as the "Belchfire 7" for a number of less than positive reasons. It's not what I would refer to the Kitfox as, though if I had not installed the collector ring, it may have been appropriate. Anyway, they were there and needed for the first start.
Look forward to seeing you at T82 anytime you can make it. I'm retired from the Army, so I know how hard they like to work you. Regards, David

Av8r3400
05-07-2010, 06:17 PM
Looper-- With the Grove gear, how much prop clearance do you have? That seems to be a good sized diameter prop...

I'd like to see a thread on the Stewart's System, too. I've been considering Stewart's for my 1200 rebuild.

49LOOPER
05-07-2010, 11:04 PM
Ground clearance is an issue with a two bladed prop and the Grove gear, as it is an inch or more lower than the bungee gear on the Kitfox IV. Rotec recommends a 76 inch diameter prop to take full advantage of the engine's performance, with large diameter props enhancing the climb rate. My prop is 72 inches in diameter and about the smallest diameter two bladed prop that should be installed on this engine according to the folks at Rotec. However, Joe Meyeres has a 70 inch Sterba prop on his Rotec powered Kitfox IV and he reports the performance is good. I have now a 10 inch clearance and expect this to be around 9 inches once the airplane is completed. I think i"ll have to go to a three bladed prop if serious rough field capability is desired, but for now I went with the Sterba because it's an inexpensive solution until I determine what I really want or need prop wise. Ed also will repitch or cut down his props once for no charge other than shipping.
I really enjoyed covering the aircraft using the Stewart System. Both Polyfiber and Stewart or STC'ed, cost difference was not a factor when I purchased my materials, both have training seminars around the country and have good training videos. Technical help was good for both. There are no hazardous material to ship or store with the Stewart System. I liked this because I was doing my project in a two car garage in a residential neighborhood. Everything cleans up with water with the Stewart System, although i found it best to use laquer thinner every other time for cleaning my HVLP gun. Weather is more flexible I think with the Stewart System, but I wouldn't swear to it because I don't remember the parameters for the Polyfiber System. I wanted to use a polyurethane paint because of the durability and The Stewart System seemed safer, though they now also recommend an outside air source unless your spraying in a very well ventilated area. I used a organic vapor charcoal spray mask when I sprayed. in my garage. With the exception of the paint , all materials , such as glue, can be poured back into it's container. Glue pot life and clamping the fabric down is avoided with the Stewart System. You just apply the glue to the tubing and in about five minutes it will hold the fabric in place. You can take your time too, and move it around until it's right
It is not permanent until you apply glue to the fabric and it soaks through to the glued tubing and dries. For me it worked well, but I know for many the known quality and experience with the Polyfiber make it still their choice. Finally, teal versus pink on the inside of your cover job.
Another system that looks pretty cool for aircraft weighing 1320 lbs or less is the German "Oratex UL 600" pre-finished aircraft covering. The fabric is already colored, so as long as one of their colors suits you, your done once you apply the fabric. Kinda like a model airplane. Their website is www.oracover.de.

SaintAero
05-29-2010, 07:03 PM
Nice work on the engine installation. I am enjoying flying mine and like others, usually spend a lot of time with people interested and curious. I used a 67x55" three-blade prop. I haven't been to cruise altitude to test the pitch, but at low altitude can exceed the 3600 RPM. During takeoff, I am seeing about 3300 RPM while climbing at 75 MPH. Here's a youtube video of the first flight. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYA5ySV9lk4 enjoy. I'd like to visit some time; just up the river at Granbury. - Don

49LOOPER
05-30-2010, 10:37 AM
Thanks Don, if I can get it to come out somewhere close to that good looking Kitfox of yours I'll be very happy. I watched your first flight video and it is very impressive. I'm glad the Rotec installation has been proven so many times before on the IV and the newer ones. From when I first started it, the engine has been very impressive. It seems almost too much for the plane. I would really like some info on what you did to prepare for your first flight.
I'm getting ready to take it to the airport (T82 Gillespie County) as soon as I complete a few more finish details and move the current occupant of the hangar to our hangar in Sedona, AZ. Most likely do that this coming week if the weather allows. I'm anxious about the weight and balance, though I followed the advice of Brian Henneman (first to install the R2800 on a Kitfox IV I believe) and Joe Meyeres about putting the battery in the tail. I've attached a photo of the battery installation. I placed an access panel direcly in front of it that allows the battery to slide forward and drop out the bottom. The space behind it allows for any additioal ballast required after weight and balance. The Tech Advisor has some high quality scales and has agreed to help me with it
I'm retired Don, so almost anytime you are inclined to arc down to Fredericksburg would be good. The Airport Diner is also open for lunch during the week and for breakfast and lunch weekends, and I would love to see your Kitfox. Best regards, David Dean

Peteohms
05-30-2010, 04:01 PM
Looks really great David. Hope to see it flying soon. Any chance you'll be at
Kittie Hill/ Sills Aviation BBQ Fly-In June 19, 2010, 12:00:00 PM

Pete

paulc
06-11-2010, 08:50 PM
Thanks Don, if I can get it to come out somewhere close to that good looking Kitfox of yours I'll be very happy. I watched your first flight video and it is very impressive. I'm glad the Rotec installation has been proven so many times before on the IV and the newer ones. From when I first started it, the engine has been very impressive. It seems almost too much for the plane. I would really like some info on what you did to prepare for your first flight.
I'm getting ready to take it to the airport (T82 Gillespie County) as soon as I complete a few more finish details and move the current occupant of the hangar to our hangar in Sedona, AZ. Most likely do that this coming week if the weather allows. I'm anxious about the weight and balance, though I followed the advice of Brian Henneman (first to install the R2800 on a Kitfox IV I believe) and Joe Meyeres about putting the battery in the tail. I've attached a photo of the battery installation. I placed an access panel direcly in front of it that allows the battery to slide forward and drop out the bottom. The space behind it allows for any additioal ballast required after weight and balance. The Tech Advisor has some high quality scales and has agreed to help me with it
I'm retired Don, so almost anytime you are inclined to arc down to Fredericksburg would be good. The Airport Diner is also open for lunch during the week and for breakfast and lunch weekends, and I would love to see your Kitfox. Best regards, David Dean

Could I ask what type and size of battery your using there as Im doing a Rotec instal now and will set it up the same way.

Paul :)

49LOOPER
06-12-2010, 01:54 PM
Hi Paul,
The battery is an Odyssey Homebuilder's 680 (Aircraft Spruce # 11-0223). The FAA approved version is about $55.00 more. It weighs 15 lbs and cost about $100.00. I've used one of these batteries for over 5 years in my Acro Sport, and they perform very well. They are sealed and maintenance free. I also used the hold down bracket for this particular battery in my Kitfox installation ( Aircraft Spruce # 11-01853). With the access panels around the battery it is easy to get to. Everything is installed using machine screws and nutplates, and the battery can be easily removed or charged in place. The access panel on the bottom of the aircraft is trapezoidal to match the taper of the fuselage bottom, and positioned in front of the battery so that it drops out the bottom once released from the hold down bracket. The aluminum opening was glued to the fabric with nutplates installed. The access panel is .025 aluminum. There is a piece of aluminum angle bracing the battery at the top that is attached with an adel clamp to a cross member. Works well. I've attached another photo.

paulc
06-12-2010, 09:44 PM
Thanks for that, yes I looked up the Odyssey website and could see the PC680 was the obvious choice.

Off the web I got the all dimensions of the PC680 (180 x 167 x 76mm) with no metal jacket and so I got right to making a dummy battery out of wood so I could work out all the bits needed for the battery installation.

I welded two 1/8 steel straps across the lower longerons, then tach welded 4 captive 1/4 nuts. The battery cradle is made out 25 x3mm Aluminum angle. The battery is bottom loaded as you can see. I will make a hatch later that covers that covers the bottom area. Worked out pretty well I think.

49LOOPER
06-12-2010, 10:02 PM
Hi Paul,
That looks really good. Always more than one way to skin a cat. Best Regards, David

SaintAero
06-14-2010, 05:21 PM
David,
Hope this is not too late for you. I have attached my First Flight test card. I serve as a flight advisor for my chapter and have helped with twenty to thirty first flights. I'll be happy to head your way when it is helpful for you.
Don Saint

49LOOPER
06-14-2010, 08:26 PM
Hi Don,
Thanks much. I will take you up on it. Though I thought I would be further along to the first flight, and not from lack of effort, I still have a ways to go. Not much I hope, but you know the story there. Again, Thanks. David