Garmin Support Available For Team Kitfox!

[G3Xpert]

Greetings from TeamX!

We would like to introduce ourselves to the group here on Team Kitfox. We are a small team of pilots, builders, and aviation enthusiasts (in addition to our day jobs as Software engineers, hardware engineers, etc) within Garmin that develops and maintains avionics for Experimental aircraft. Our group will be getting involved with the Team Kitfox community and provide any support for Garmin avionics installations as needed. We will regularly check in on the forums to see if there are any questions or comments that we are able to assist with.

The capabilities of our systems are largely driven by feedback from the community, so please, if there are any software or hardware improvements that may make your life as an pilot/builder/maintainer easier, send them our way!

We look forward to getting to know everyone!

Thanks,

Justin

[desertdave]

Welcome! So many Garmin avionics questions asked on Team Kitfox and now we can go right to the source.
I should be powering up my G3x is the next 30 days and am sure I will need your input.

[bbs428]

Welcome! So many Garmin avionics questions asked on Team Kitfox and now we can go right to the source.
I should be powering up my G3x is the next 30 days and am sure I will need your input.


Agreed! Mighty handy to have you Garmin professionals with us. Welcome aboard!

[efwd]

I received a G3X Service Bulletin this morning. If you have an autopilot, beware. I experienced a nose down trim input once, a few months ago when I turned it on. Sent me down to about 20degrees nose down before I shut it off. At the time, I figured I had something programmed incorrectly. It hasn't happened again since then so I wrote it off. This software update addresses the uncommanded trim input when turning the unit on.

[G3Xpert]

I received a G3X Service Bulletin this morning. If you have an autopilot, beware. I experienced a nose down trim input once, a few months ago when I turned it on. Sent me down to about 20degrees nose down before I shut it off. At the time, I figured I had something programmed incorrectly. It hasn't happened again since then so I wrote it off. This software update addresses the uncommanded trim input when turning the unit on.

Hi Eddie!

Do you happen to have a Flight Data Log from this flight? We would like to evaluate the autopilot performance data from the flight to see what happened. You can send it to us directly at G3Xpert@Garmin.com.

The bulletin we recently issued was resolved with software update v9.12 for GDU 4XX displays. This can be downloaded here: https://support.garmin.com/en-US/?partNumber=010-01057-00&tab=software

Thanks,

Justin

[G3Xpert]

Welcome! So many Garmin avionics questions asked on Team Kitfox and now we can go right to the source.
I should be powering up my G3x is the next 30 days and am sure I will need your input.

You got it Dave! Happy to be here!

Thanks,

Justin

[efwd]

Hello Justin
This happened many months ago and I am not sure how I would identify what day that occured. Feel Free to PM me if you have information on how to download what you might need.
Eddie

[Shadowrider]

Thanks! I think this is a great idea having you on the forum.

Just did the most recent G3x and so far I am liking that update. Traffic callout if cool!
One suggestion I have for garmin in progressive audio like the new cars that adjust stereo based on vehicle speed? They should do that on the G3x. Volume can be lower when your idle or taxing around, but goes louder as you start flying faster!

[Eric Page]

Here's a question for Garmin:

Alex (@alexM) and I just flew a G3X-equipped Kitfox for several hours. On each takeoff and landing the chirping tones associated with AOA were crushingly loud in the headset (radio and intercom communication were nearly impossible) and continued for an absurdly long time on landing, especially into a stiff headwind. We looked at the Audio settings screen but couldn't find a volume control for this feature. Alex will be flying this plane again (and I might be involved), so we'd like to get this feature under control. Can it be turned down? If not, can it be turned off? In either case, how? Thanks.

[desertdave]

Justin,
I just sent you a private message with a question regarding my Garmin oil pressure sender.

Thanks,
Dave

[Shadowrider]

Here's a question for Garmin:

Alex (@alexM) and I just flew a G3X-equipped Kitfox for several hours. On each takeoff and landing the chirping tones associated with AOA were crushingly loud in the headset (radio and intercom communication were nearly impossible) and continued for an absurdly long time on landing, especially into a stiff headwind. We looked at the Audio settings screen but couldn't find a volume control for this feature. Alex will be flying this plane again (and I might be involved), so we'd like to get this feature under control. Can it be turned down? If not, can it be turned off? In either case, how? Thanks.


You can adjust the volume of each alert. You go into config and can adjust and test the volume.

[Eric Page]

You can adjust the volume of each alert. You go into config and can adjust and test the volume.
Thanks, Dustin. Do you get there via menus in the normal flight mode, or from a special key sequence during boot-up?

[Shadowrider]

Sorry I thought you’re a g3x user! Hold menu down while turning on the g3x until you see configuration mode appear. Just read your flight report. Sounds like quite the adventure! The g3x is wired to the master switch so that you have engine gauges on starting the engine. So, when the vpx gets power the g3x turns on. I think there is a way to read faults while flying. Eddie knows how but I think it’s a submenu? Sorry I don’t have a IS engine but someone posted a YouTube video. I will see if I can find it.

[Shadowrider]

Found it! 912is and 915is user can access lane fault data while flying.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ip3X8BlD-I

[Eric Page]

Thanks again, Dustin. That's very useful info.

Re the VP-X controlling power to the G3X... In the airplane that we flew, the G3X would indeed turn on with the Master Switch. The problem we encountered was that once the engine was running, it was impossible to turn off the G3X. Is this normal behavior for a VP-X based system?

[Shadowrider]

Yes that is normal, it’s displaying vital engines gauges like oil pressure and rpm ect.

[Eric Page]

Hmmm, OK. That raises more questions, but I won't hijack this thread going down that rabbit hole...

Thanks, Dustin!

[Shadowrider]

Justin I have a question for you. I just did the 9.13 update to the G3X along with the update to my GTX45R transponder. I read that rs-232 connection was maxed out and part of the updates is to use the new Connect protocol for ADSB weather data. Will this speed up the rate at which you download ADSB data? Is there any settings that I need to make or is the automatic once the update is done. "G3X is currently connected to transponder via bluetooth as well as rs-232"

[G3Xpert]

Hi Dustin,

The new Connext protocol will work just fine as long as you set the ports on both sides. That being said, it is not necessary at this point. That ability was introduced to facilitate future development!

Thanks,

Justin

[G3Xpert]

Here's a question for Garmin:

Alex (@alexM) and I just flew a G3X-equipped Kitfox for several hours. On each takeoff and landing the chirping tones associated with AOA were crushingly loud in the headset (radio and intercom communication were nearly impossible) and continued for an absurdly long time on landing, especially into a stiff headwind. We looked at the Audio settings screen but couldn't find a volume control for this feature. Alex will be flying this plane again (and I might be involved), so we'd like to get this feature under control. Can it be turned down? If not, can it be turned off? In either case, how? Thanks.

Hi Eric,

Press and hold the MENU button while powering on the display. Touch Sound, and there is an option to modify the AOA tone volume.

Thanks,

Justin

[Eric Page]

Thanks, Justin. I appreciate the info, and I'm sure Alex will too.

[Shadowrider]

Anyone else do the lastest firmware upgrade for the G3X? Seems the flip flop radio feature is slow now? When you tap the frequencies to flip them, they seem to go slow now. Sometimes it normal, but sometimes I end up pushing it twice thinking I didn't tap it and it does a double flip flop to back where I started? Justin do you have any insight on this?

[PapuaPilot]

I haven't noticed it, but I usually do that with the GTR-200 radio.

[bbs428]

Thought I'd post one of my experiences with the Garmin G3x.

After initial power up and software update, I was performing some basic checks of the G3x system. Noticed I had no audio/sidetone in my headset? When I keyed the ptt I could see "tx" light up on the 200b. When I keyed my handheld radio I could see "rx" light up as well.

Ohmed out my com jack wires - checked good. Checked for any shorts to ground on my main connector J2001 - checked good. Checked my headset with my handheld radio - checked good.
So now I'm stumped. A call into Garmin got the obligatory "you need to see a professional to do your wiring and we will RMA the unit only once". Was hoping for a bit more like "make sure you check this" or "check that" convo, but that didn't happen.
I do understand that the tech's get hundreds of phone calls and can only troubleshoot so much over the phone, so I just put on my big boy pants, grabbed my fluke and headed back to the plane.

I stood there scratching my head, thinking about the issue. "Start from the beginning once more bunky" came to mind, so this time around I checked the coax at the antenna. Dead short from the center conductor to the back shell!
The reason I had not checked this earlier is that I had checked the coax after building it and it checked good! Disconnected the coax and it still checked good. Checked the center conductor on coax output on the 200b and it was shorted to the case internally! Wow. Never crossed my mind to check the 200b itself! I just figured my wiring was afu.

So, my brand new radio was a brick!

I had purchased my avionics over 2 1/2 years ago, so the warranties are out. Garmin recognizes that it takes a while to build an airplane and graciously takes that into account. When I called my friendly Garmin tech, he was happy to hear the issue was sorted out. They asked me how many hours were on the plane - zero and an RMA was granted immediately! My new radio is on its way as we speak.

So, for all you DIY's out there, do not assume the shiny, new box is good and your stuff is bad. Check everything!

[efwd]

I had "Two" autopilot servos that were bad. John M had told me he had experienced one servo problem and was very suspicious as to having two at the same time. Garmin was contacted and servos were replaced right away as they were brand new and on the shelf for about two years before discovered. Thanks Garmin.

[G3Xpert]

Anyone else do the lastest firmware upgrade for the G3X? Seems the flip flop radio feature is slow now? When you tap the frequencies to flip them, they seem to go slow now. Sometimes it normal, but sometimes I end up pushing it twice thinking I didn't tap it and it does a double flip flop to back where I started? Justin do you have any insight on this?

Good Afternoon,

We were able to recreate this report. You can expect a software update that will address this problem and correct the issue.

Thanks,

Justin

[G3Xpert]

Thought I'd post one of my experiences with the Garmin G3x.

After initial power up and software update, I was performing some basic checks of the G3x system. Noticed I had no audio/sidetone in my headset? When I keyed the ptt I could see "tx" light up on the 200b. When I keyed my handheld radio I could see "rx" light up as well.

Ohmed out my com jack wires - checked good. Checked for any shorts to ground on my main connector J2001 - checked good. Checked my headset with my handheld radio - checked good.
So now I'm stumped. A call into Garmin got the obligatory "you need to see a professional to do your wiring and we will RMA the unit only once". Was hoping for a bit more like "make sure you check this" or "check that" convo, but that didn't happen.
I do understand that the tech's get hundreds of phone calls and can only troubleshoot so much over the phone, so I just put on my big boy pants, grabbed my fluke and headed back to the plane.

I stood there scratching my head, thinking about the issue. "Start from the beginning once more bunky" came to mind, so this time around I checked the coax at the antenna. Dead short from the center conductor to the back shell!
The reason I had not checked this earlier is that I had checked the coax after building it and it checked good! Disconnected the coax and it still checked good. Checked the center conductor on coax output on the 200b and it was shorted to the case internally! Wow. Never crossed my mind to check the 200b itself! I just figured my wiring was afu.

So, my brand new radio was a brick!

I had purchased my avionics over 2 1/2 years ago, so the warranties are out. Garmin recognizes that it takes a while to build an airplane and graciously takes that into account. When I called my friendly Garmin tech, he was happy to hear the issue was sorted out. They asked me how many hours were on the plane - zero and an RMA was granted immediately! My new radio is on its way as we speak.

So, for all you DIY's out there, do not assume the shiny, new box is good and your stuff is bad. Check everything!

Thank you for the feedback Brett. I am curious about your call to us. Did you call our experimental help desk (1-866-854-8433)? You should not get the run around to "see a dealer" if so.

Thanks,

Justin

[bbs428]

Thanks Justin for the reply.

I was able to talk to a "Toby" in the certified section. He was an ex TACAN aimd tech. helping out the experimental calls the other day. Great convo with him and he walked me through some things to look for. Super guy. Really knows his stuff! Told him of the shorted coax center conductor and he said they will all read like that, and the problem was probably in the com jacks or associated wiring. So, after double checking the wiring, I replaced all the Com jacks with new ones and my problem was solved!

Very Hard to troubleshoot over the phone with amateurs who are not familiar with the G3x. I'm sure it was just a lack of communication on my end. I'll not fault the tech that day who took my call. I was probably the 100th caller who had a hard time understanding all that's involved.

[G3Xpert]

Thanks Justin for the reply.

I was able to talk to a "Toby" in the certified section. He was an ex TACAN aimd tech. helping out the experimental calls the other day. Great convo with him and he walked me through some things to look for. Super...

Sounds great. It isn't very hard to get routed to the wrong desk if you call the main number. The experimental help desk is where you want to end up as they are set up to work more directly with owners/maintainers than the group who works with the Certified fleet.

You're exactly right too, it can be quite challenging to help work on a plane that is 700 miles away!

Let us know if anything else comes up.

Thanks,

Justin

[Shadowrider]

Good Afternoon,

We were able to recreate this report. You can expect a software update that will address this problem and correct the issue.

Thanks,

Justin

Awesome! Thanks for the info and update!

[Project_RavenFox]

Hello Justin - it's great to find Garmin's awesome Customer Support connecting with the homebuilt community like this – thank you!


I'm some way off wiring my Kitfox Series 7 SS build, but knowing how long aircraft re-wire jobs can take* I''d like to make a start on the planning and drawing a wiring diagram.


* I've rewired three homebuilt aircraft of varying complexity over the years. I'm also very familiar with some of Garmin Avionics' excellent design features and best practices after installing a few 430/530's, way back when; I especially appreciated the provision of earth bus blocks on equipment connectors – and plenty of signal-earth pins in comms equipment connectors! After wiring a variety of other manufacturer's equipment, wiring Garmin radio/audio equipment is just a dream!



Regarding the design of G3X-based installations for the Kitfox:

Does Garmin offer any top-level electrical system architecture design guidance or recommendations, in order to ensure a reliable, fault-tolerant, EMI (radio interference) noise-free flying experience?

I'm especially interested in learning about any the design philosophy around the need for an avionics master switch and/or other emer-electrical system switches. Bob Nuckolls (AeroElectricConnection.com, ex-Ratheon engineer, etc, etc) who you might know of, strongly advocates against fitting an avionics master as doing so (generally speaking) only introduces another single-point failure-mode, rather than improving overall electrical system reliability.


Lastly, having used AutoCAD and KiCAD over the years, for creating aircraft wiring diagrams (and learning all the short-comings of those packages for wire-diagramming in the process) do you or any the other members here have any recommendations for free open source software (FOSS) for electrical diagramming? I'm otherwise inclined to give the 'excellent but a little quirky' QelectroTech package a go for my Kitfox (its output quality is top-notch, but component design is currently a little quirky). Which ever FOSS diagramming tool I use, I intend making the various equipment diagrams I create available as a library of components, assuming Garmin would have no objection? On that note, if Garmin has any CSV data available (lists of equipment name vs connector name vs pin numbers vs pin function) for any or all its avionic equipment, that would be a huge help and head-start! Some time ago I made a CSV to KiCAD component converter script and should be able to adapt it to similarly create QElectroTech components from CSV data.


Thanks for any insight or info,
Hamish

[Project_RavenFox]

Just spotted the Garmin Avionics Solutions for Kitfox Aircraft Webinar advert, over on the general discussion forum:

4pm Central

Monday 26 June

https://teamkitfox.com/Forums/threads/12734-Garmin-Avionics-Solutions-for-Kitfox-Aircraft-Webinar-June-26th-4pm-Central-Time

Thanks guys, look forward to attending!