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JoeRuscito
12-10-2021, 11:39 AM
Currently running a 70in Whirlwind ground adjustable on my 912is. Overall I'm very happy with the performance. I tend to run it slightly favoring climb performance.

I've been considering upgrading to the airmaster, my main goal is squeezing a bit of cruise performance out of it (I currently get about 104 mph, 5500 RPM, grove gear, 26's). However I do not want to give up any of my take off performance, and it would be great to gain a bit of course!

In flight adjustable seems like an obvious choice and I would like the groups opinions.

That said, I've also been told there may be other props/diameters out there that would improve my performance on both ends over the whirlwind, without the complexity of an in-flight adjustable. Would love thought here too.

Considering all options/opinions!

Benbell4140
12-10-2021, 12:03 PM
I ordered this one a few weeks ago. I’m using an o-200 which will not allow in flight adjustment but this particular prop can be adjusted on the ground in seconds. There is a tiny hole in the spinner and you insert the tool and rotate to change pitch. All 3 blades change at the same time. And this prop can be adjusted in flight on a rotax engine. They will work with you on the price also. PM me if your interested.


http://www.duc-propellers-usa.com/rubrique.php?id_rubrique=91


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Eric Page
12-10-2021, 02:20 PM
That's a very interesting prop, and I nearly ordered one myself. It makes a lot of sense as an upgrade/retrofit, or for someone installing a used or rebuilt engine, where they don't have the option to order the Type 3 gearbox which has a pad for driving a hydraulic governor.

It's similar to the Airmaster in that the controller is electronic, but different in that the actual prop adjustment is done via a small electrically powered hydraulic pump instead of an electric motor (that's the black box shown below the controller instrument on DUC's website). It drives prop pitch via a pushrod through the hub; there are no slip rings behind the spinner.

In the end I opted for their FLASHBLACK-M, which is a conventional hydraulic constant speed prop. I wanted to get the faster response of a fully hydro-mechanical governor, and the price difference was minimal. Since I was ordering my engine as well, I could get the Type 3 gearbox.

Kitfox Guy
12-11-2021, 06:03 PM
Don’t rule our ground adjustable props just yet. I put one on mine and love it. It only takes 5 minutes to repitch the prop and a handy torque wrench. Pitch it for the type of flight you want, climb or cruise. In reality you ultimately find a “sweet spot” that simultaneously meets both performance profiles.

JoeRuscito
12-17-2021, 08:39 AM
I currently have the ground adjustable whirlwind and while I have found a "sweet spot" for my flying, I believe I'm still leaving a lot on the table. Currently I climb out at around 60-65 MPH and show around 5600 RPM. I can imagine if I was showing another 200 RPM there would likely be a bit of a performance bump. On the other end, straight and level, I will QUICKLY blow through 5800 RPM if I do not pull back. SO that makes me think I could put in quite a lot more pitch in the prop to hold the RPM at 5500 and get places a bit faster.

The whirlwind takes WAY longer than 5 min to re-pitch correctly.

The DUC is interesting to me because it simply take one long allen driver to repitch on the ground. This IMHO is practical ground adjustability.

All else is a PIA and isn't something you are going to do daily. For example fly to a destination a couple hours away with course pitch, land and re-pitch for playing.

Denalifox
12-17-2021, 09:37 AM
Has anyone looked in the Sensenich GA prop? Repitch uses an indexing pin and can be done in about 10 mins including spinner removal. Pre determined pitch pins you slide in and just rotate the blades until they touch. Not sure they make one for the Rotax hub, but Im betting you could find a adapter to run it. Real slick setup.

Kitfox Guy
12-17-2021, 11:29 AM
Thats what I have my Continental 0-200 attached to , I love it. Yes they make them for Rotax hubs, two and three blade models.

SWeidemann
12-21-2021, 07:18 AM
So, I’m wondering if your Sensenich is a two blade and what the diameter is? I am always thinking about what prop I will use on my 912 ULS powered Vixen (currently using a Ivo Ultralight). The seemingly more efficient blade angle adjustments (used by the Sensenich) is very attractive. Sensenich has been around for lots of years and is a domestic company (made in the USA).

I am also curious about whether Sensenich will eventually get into carbon fiber ground adjustable propellers for a Cessna 150 Certified aircraft (I have one of those too). As of now, Sensenich does have a STC’d prop for the O-200 and O-235 on Cubs.

Skot

Kitfox Guy
12-21-2021, 10:04 AM
Visit their website and all your questions will be answered.

https://www.sensenich.com/product-category/aircraft/

3kdscf
06-20-2023, 07:34 AM
The whirlwind takes WAY longer than 5 min to re-pitch correctly.

The DUC is interesting to me because it simply take one long allen driver to repitch on the ground. This IMHO is practical ground adjustability.



It takes me a full hour to re-pitch my Whirlwind and because you have to do it every 50 hours as part of the inspection procedure, its a real pain. I regret buying a whirlwind for this reason. The DUC sounds like a dream.

SWeidemann
06-20-2023, 09:04 AM
It takes me a full hour to re-pitch my Whirlwind and because you have to do it every 50 hours as part of the inspection procedure, its a real pain. I regret buying a whirlwind for this reason. The DUC sounds like a dream.

Sounds like an annoying procedure, especially if you are tripping & flying a lot. I did get a used Sensenich with intentions of mounting this. It has a pitch pin setting procedure and a large spinner & backplate (which was one of my goals for being able to dynamically balance as well). Since my acquisition, I have seen comments that even the Sensenich pin system will only get you close to where you want to be (before doing to the old fashioned protractor assisted setting method). We will see.

desertdave
06-20-2023, 10:54 AM
It takes me a full hour to re-pitch my Whirlwind and because you have to do it every 50 hours as part of the inspection procedure, its a real pain. I regret buying a whirlwind for this reason. The DUC sounds like a dream.

Re-pitch or verify the pitch hasn't moved? It shouldn't change unless bolts are loose which is a completely different issue.

3kdscf
06-20-2023, 02:43 PM
Re-pitch or verify the pitch hasn't moved? It shouldn't change unless bolts are loose which is a completely different issue.



The 50 hour inspection procedure specified by Whirlwind says that you have to disassemble the entire hub, inspect all the parts, then re-assemble. You are right though, if it were not for this procedure there would be no need to repitch every 50 hours. Its actually pretty annoying and I suspect that this extensive 50hr inspection requirement is just a CYA move by whirlwind rather than something warranted by past failures. Attached is the relevant page from the manual.32509

jiott
06-21-2023, 10:12 AM
I have a Whirlwind and only did the 50 hour check after the first 50 hours. After that, I check annually (at the annual condition inspection) and I admit that sometimes I don't do a compete disassembly if pitch measurements show nothing has moved and bolt torques are good.

mike92104
06-24-2023, 02:14 AM
I was looking at the E-Prop Glorieuse the other day. Looked like an interesting alternative.

skyguy04
01-25-2024, 06:23 PM
I too am in the market for a new prob. Currently flying a 3-blade 68" Warp Drive. It has good performance, but a little heavy and not easily ground adjustable. I've been debating on the Duc easy ground adjust or IFA. The e-prob looks almost too good to be true. 4kg for hydraulic IFA with electronic control?!? I've got to see one of these things in action.