Whats your idea of first takeoff?

[87kitfox1]

I am getting ready to takeoff for the first time. I have been taxing and practicing getting the tail off the ground. I have a 1987 Kitfox 1 with a Rotax 503. I have worked out a few of the misc. problems, like brakes not working right, Etc.
On first takeoff should I bunny hop down runway or full throttle and get to altitude and then start breathing? What did you do?

Thanks, Will

[SkyPirate]

I would approach it this way :

First flight day should be calm,..little traffic around the airport ,..
take off and get out of ground effect as soon as possible once you rotate ,..if everything felt good once out of ground effect ..do some slight turns left and right and some pitch control maneuvers ,..and all of this before you reach the 1/2 way mark of the runway length ,..just incase you need to set her back down ,..if all feels good ..climb straight out get to a pattern altitude and fly the pattern.
with any airplane once your out of ground effect ( the length of the wing above the ground) any discrepencies will be very obvious so be prepared,..a wing could drop slightly( take note of stick location in level flight),..the nose could all of a sudden feel heavy ,..if your prop pitch is set for quick take off it will take more rudder to keep straight at first ,..etc..
once your in the pattern on your down wind ,..adjust the throttle a little to see what speed the plane will fly straight and level without much control imput,..if it's in your perameters for cruise your good to go ,..if it isn't ..then adjust your flaperons a little bit up or down,..this will trim out a kitfox quick,...
for landing ,..I would not try to 3 point it ,..on a tail dragger,..I'd land with a little speed then set the tail down,..

good luck and happy flying~!!!

after you have completed this ,..you'll need to get a crow bar to pry the grin off your face ha ha ,..they have some over the counter medication for facial strain but it doesn't work on the "kitfox Grin"

Chase

forgot ,..you had said your flying a 503 ,..important ,..once your at cruise ,..watch your tach EGT's and CHT's ,..sometimes on the 503 ,..around 5400 rpm ..the EGT's will climb fast,..this can be remedied with some carb ajustemnt after first flight is completed ,..if EGT's look like they are going to spike ,..either raise RPM slightly ,..or drop RPM and give a little flaperon adjustment ,..pull up on flaperon stick to keep altitude,..you'll have to also hold back on stick to compensate ,.. once back on the ground ,,move the jet needle one notch up or down and fly the pattern again,..if this doesn't remedy the issue you'll need to rejet.
so to add to the excitement ..watch your guages

Chase

[cap01]

hi will . how you handle your first flight surely depends on your flying experience . like how much tail dragger time you have . the more you run up and down the runway with the tail up the more your inviting disaster . picking a good day for the first flight is pretty important , like not a lot of gusting wind . no reason to add any more factors to the mix. if you built the plane you should know it intimately but it helps to have someone else to look the airplane over for things you may have missed before you fly it .
the first flight of mine was from a private strip and by the time i had taxied to the end of the runway the runway was lined with people in lawn chairs waiting to see the action . i didnt know that many people lived there or how they found out i was going to fly that day . as it turned out it was a non event but what a great feeling after all the work to get there , i came back and gased up and flew again . i think my biggest problems with the kitfox was getting used to flying so slow on approach also getting her to come down when i pull power abeam of the end of the runway on downwind .
and if the skills arent up to the task the better part of valor is finding someone with kitfox time to fly it and give you some dual .
good luck and they are a real hoot when you get it going .
chuck
40kf
model IV 1050
912ul
warpdrive

[SkyPirate]

I second the "tail dragger Flying experience" it's not the same as a tricycle especially if it's yours and the planes first tail dragger flight.

Chase

[87kitfox1]

What a reply, Thanks for all the info. I have not done very much time in a tail dragger. I need a few more hours before solo or first flight. All the guys I hang around are Helicopter guys. Nobody that flies tail draggers or fixed wing aircraft. I need to go and get my tail wheel endorsement and I think I would feel good about the first flight. I am really excited about getting her in the air, I just wanted a general idea from all you guys that fly these birds. Thanks Again, Will

[Dave S]

Hi Will,

Congratulations on getting ready for your first flight. There is so much to say about the first flight of a new airplane.

If you don't already have it - One highly recommended reference is the FAA's advisory circular AC 90-89A "Amateur built aircraft and ultralight flight testing handbook" Lots of good ideas to consider.

here is the link:

http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAdvisoryCircular.nsf/0/D08FA9393154B636862569BA006F6D7F?OpenDocument&Highlight=amateur-built%20aircraft

A first flight needs to be taken seriously - think it through - set up a plan then fly it - If a person does everything they can to stack the deck in their favor - that is what is needed.

What do I do? - First off, I dissed all of my family and friends except for a two person ground crew with a radio, cell phone and camera. Picked a day with no wind, during a weekday morning with nobody around, longest runway with the biggest clear space beyond the airport, sun on my back. Set up the first flight plan pretty much like the advisory circular format - was as certain as I could be that everything was right and assumed that just about anything and everything could go wrong. Did a final high speed taxi test on the runway then the first takeoff - ready for an abort at the first sign of anything going bad - since nothing went sour - just did a normal climb to pattern altitude - just gentle maneuvers to determine if controls worked, Circled the field a couple times - went to 3000 feet - power off stall to get some idea where the ASI should be on approach - assumed the first landing would be a go around unless it looked good - still don't know why, but the first approach resulted in a no-flaps landing. First flight time was one hour - never got out of spitting distance from the airport in case the engine developed an attitude problem. Everything worked fine - left wing a bit heavy and in need of some fine tuning on the rigging but that is to be expected and no big deal.

The KF grin that everyone is talking about? ITS REAL! NOBODY can erase that from your face 'cuz you just did something that few people do - built an airplane and took off in it!

Oh yeah? The family and friends - Had an open house at the hangar a week later - a person needs to remember those who put up with you and helped all along the way during the build. Although a person cannot give any rides till the testing is successfully complete - I was compelled to do a few circuits around the patch - With the number of witnesses, including the DAR who issue the AWC and his wife with a camera - I figured that I had next to no chance of making a graceful landing; but, the Kitfox kept me from embarrasing myself and apparently murphy was asleep at the stick....

Main idea with the first flight is to keep yourself and the airplane in the gene pool - While ours is a trigear, if a person has a tailwheel - be darn sure that you have way too much recent experience landing a tailwheel then double it.

Yep - and work that grin for all it is worth!

Sincerely,

Dave S
St Paul, MN

[Slyfox]

I think if you are that much in the green for tail wheel time, my advice is to stay on the ground and do no more taxi test unless they are slow and the tail stays on the ground. With that said, first flights are to be done with full throttle and get er up in the air and to pattern altitude. Than you can breath easy and do orbits over the field until you find out what the stall is at and set yourself up for a landing. Again, I don't think you have enough experience for flying the tail wheel yet, and it's not legal to fly anyway without the endorsement, so go get one. If there is someone that will do it for you, take that into concideration also.

[87kitfox1]

I agree Slyfox. I have to get myself ready before the big day. I am looking at a school that has a j-3 cub that I will do some time in. Thanks for all the input.

[Dave Holl]

Will
What the other guys have said is very good advice.
I am building a MK 7 and I also have over 900 hours on a Jodel 1050 which is a tail dragger and a J3 Cub. I do not intend to do the first flight until I have a few hours in the R/H seat of a kitfox to get use to it!
My advice is get a tailwheel check out and the J3 cub is a great aircraft to do it in, and as they say if you can fly a cub you can fly anything BUT the kitfox will have much lighter controls and is a lighter aircraft than the Cub so my advice would be after you are checked out on the Cub try and get some time in the R/H seat (or if you are lucky L/H seat) of a Kitfox or similar type before flying your pride and joy!
rgds
Dave

[Av8r3400]

Keep in mind that a Kitfox is much lighter and shorter than a Cub or a Champ and will spin around on the ground much quicker on roll-out if you don't stay ahead of it.

Jumping into a Kitfox without any transition training is a dangerous proposition. I was lucky to have an experienced instructor (JimS (http://www.teamkitfox.com/Forums/member.php?u=508)) do transition training with me.

[avidflyer]

Another thing to keep in mind is the shape of the Kitfox cowl and the way it angles in can make you want to come in crossed up which can be rough on the gear and even give you a good start on a groundloop. Especially on a paved strip. Also, if you are used to flying a single seat or tandum, you might have a tendency to want to look through the center of the prop, but with the side by side seating, then you are flying crossed up because you uncounciously want to look through the prop like you are used to. I even put a small piece of tape on the bottom of the windshield to help me see where I should be looking. Taxing in a straight line and looking way ahead shows where the tape should be. There is a real good small book titled How to fly a Kitfox, it can be a big help. Try to get one of these books if you can. Take care, Jim Chuk

[cap01]

i suppose that round cowl thing about not lining up straight can be a problem for some people but for us shorter people that cant see the cowl its not an issue
cp
kitfox IV 1050
yelm, wa

[rwaltman]

That was a problem for me - I learned to fly in gliders. When I started taking lessons in common SEL trainers (Cessna 150/2, Tomahawk, Cherokee) I could not (at the beginning) align the plane properly on take offs and landings.
Was trying to keep my nose, the airplane's nose and the runway centerline aligned. That only works OK when you are sitting on the plane's middle.

I am planning also to put narrow strips of masking tape on my kitfox windshield (center, left and right) to give better visual clues of the proper alignment.

Roberto.

[SkyPirate]

The easiest way to line up on center line from the pilot seat is to mentally put your right shoulder and hip on the line ,..look all the way down the runway at an imaginary line 2 foot to the left of the center line ,..don't look right in front of you ,..you will be wagging the tail to keep her straight,..which could end up in a ground loop,..when landing do the same ..look all the way down the runway at that imaginary line that is 2 foot left of the runway line ..if you need an aid ..ask first if you can do this ..put a cone 2 foot to the left of the line at each end of the runway your using.
Sometimes trying to hard to land center of the runway can be asking for trouble ..the plane doesn't care if you land center or not,.. there are no center lines on most grass strips ,..you pick a spot you intend on touching down and aim her towards a point at the end of the runway,..ie "the cone"
Get the basics down first ..then work on making it look pretty

Chase

[Slyfox]

OK, I'll admit it. I don't land center line all the time. Sometimes, when I'm bored, I'll do a landing and land on the left edge of the runway, than I'll flat turn it and touch down again on the right side of the runway, and... than I'll flat turn it again and land it on the center line, I know smart a..

[SkyPirate]

lol Show off :P try this Steve,..touch down on one main wheel ..keep it on the line as long as you can,..then pop her off the ground and land on the other main I use to do that all the time ,..of course I always got comments from the bystanders ,..yer gonna wreck that thar plane some day ~!! etc,.etc..
I was just living life that's all

Chase

[Slyfox]

Ok you asked for it. Try this one, land right down the middle, than lift the right wheel and than, while doing the wheelie, move the plane over and run the left wheel on the center line, than move it back over and put it back on two wheels right center down the runway, you know left wheel on the left of the center and right wheel to the right of center perfect, than raise the left wheel and do the same thing on the same touch and go. The right side is a real doosey because your sitting on the left and you don't see the right wheel.

[SkyPirate]

<grinnin> done that I can see when I'm done with this current project and I go back onto getting a model 4 ,..we will have to meet up and do some flying together maybe some fancy ground work competition ..with a case of Rotax oil as the query ha ha

I've only done this a couple times in a kitfox ,..land with speed,..useing the brakes to slow once on the ground and keeping the tail up with power ,..taxi all the way to the hangar with tail up ,.( this is on a tail dragger) then set her down with tail pointed towards hangar ready to park her for the night and do it without bouncing her tail when you set it down

Chase