John's Build

[dcsfoto]

data plates must be steel or stainless " fireproof"
CFR Part 45.11(a)

David Kelm
7SS 912Is

[jrevens]

Thanks David. Back in the day, data plates weren't required at all on the exterior of an airplane. I could be wrong, but I think somebody came up with that rule in the late '80s. Anyway, the reg. you reference doesn't specify "steel or stainless steel", just "fireproof". I wonder if aluminum is "fireproof" enough? The requirement for engines and many other parts uses the same wording under that same regulation, and I've seen aluminum data plates on many engines. AeroGraphics has these made for all kinds of aircraft - I'm curious now about what they would say. If my inspector doesn't like it, at least it will be easy to change. I appreciate the heads-up!

Just looked it up, and evidently data plates are not required on Experimental aircraft engines. I'm probably wrong about not needing external data plates "back in the day" also, but it seems like that rule came to my and other builder's attention around the time I stated. It was general practice, and I believe a rule, to have a more complete data plate mounted inside the airplane in a visible location with manufacturer's/builder's name, address, date of manufacture, engine info, etc., but then everybody had to install the external plates also. I guess I'll probably talk to AeroGraphics and see if they will make me one out of S.S. Anybody else have an aluminum plate?

[HighWing]

I have really enjoyed this most recent report and the comments. I too am a steam gauge kind of guy. For some reason, the classic look of the Kitfox demands a classic look everywhere. I do understand, though, the other point of view. Regarding data plates, as I recall, the plate needs to be permanently mounted to the airframe. In my experience, the vast majority are mounted on the removable panel under the horizontal stabilizer. Not in strict compliance with the regs, but never-the-less accepted by many if not all examiners over the years. Your mounting is definitely more in compliance than mine. With that in mind, I dont recall an after inspection discussion on a forum or email group talking about having to do the data plate install over sgain - this in 23 years.

Can't wait to see the project up close and personal.

[Dave S]

Hey John,

FWIW - it is true that a single regulation may be enforced differently by different folks sanctioned to apply such regulations.

The DAR I had (who was also an EAA tech counselor) was noted for being very thorough in his inspections - he was - we spent 13 hours in the hangar that day - A trait that I was genuinely looking for in a DAR. Anyway, I used a simple stainless steel piece, stamped the required data, and riveted through the skin with SS rivets which included a SS loop behind the fabric around, but not in contact with an airframe tube. My only sin was stamping <first name> <last name> on the plate while my registration was the other way around - that got caught on the pre AW review (I utilized two EAA tech counselors for two in process reviews and the final pre cert review). Anyway - with some careful drilling I managed to remove the SS rivets, fabricate a new plate and re-rivet it in place to agree with the registration format of <last name> <first name>.

In the end, I think person has to realize the only reason for this little exterior "fireproof" plate secured to the airframe is so someone can find out who it used to be in the event of a complete auger job terminating in a smoking pit - which admittedly has little utility for the actual occupants in that case. In our builder lives/daily lives/actual lives - all we want is to get our airworthiness certificate and have a safe plane - the existence of the plate has no observable effect on safety. As I mentioned - there is going to be variation in enforcement from time to time - I suspect inspectors are just as succepible to being members of the human race as are pilots, builders and mechanics.

[avidflyer]

I believe I read somewhere that the data plate under the tail of the airplane came about because of the DEA and planes being used to haul illegal drugs. JImChuk

[jrevens]

I think you're right, Jim. Thanks!

[jiott]

I used the SS data plate that came with the EAA registration kit. By the way I highly recommend this kit fro EAA for about $5 I believe. It has all the forms and leads you step-by-step thru the whole process of gathering documents and submitting them to the FAA for your initial registration and application for AW inspection.

[Av8r3400]

Take your data plate to your local trophy shop for engraving. They will do a very neat job and make it look more professional that a hand drawn buzz pencil engraving. They did mine for $5.

I put a slight bend in mine and attached it directly to a horizontal tube at the base of the horizontal stabilizer. Looks nice and it is solid.

[jrevens]

Hey John,

FWIW - it is true that a single regulation may be enforced differently by different folks sanctioned to apply such regulations.

The DAR I had (who was also an EAA tech counselor) was noted for being very thorough in his inspections - he was - we spent 13 hours in the hangar that day - A trait that I was genuinely looking for in a DAR. Anyway, I used a simple stainless steel piece, stamped the required data, and riveted through the skin with SS rivets which included a SS loop behind the fabric around, but not in contact with an airframe tube. My only sin was stamping <first name> <last name> on the plate while my registration was the other way around - that got caught on the pre AW review (I utilized two EAA tech counselors for two in process reviews and the final pre cert review). Anyway - with some careful drilling I managed to remove the SS rivets, fabricate a new plate and re-rivet it in place to agree with the registration format of <last name> <first name>.

In the end, I think person has to realize the only reason for this little exterior "fireproof" plate secured to the airframe is so someone can find out who it used to be in the event of a complete auger job terminating in a smoking pit - which admittedly has little utility for the actual occupants in that case. In our builder lives/daily lives/actual lives - all we want is to get our airworthiness certificate and have a safe plane - the existence of the plate has no observable effect on safety. As I mentioned - there is going to be variation in enforcement from time to time - I suspect inspectors are just as succepible to being members of the human race as are pilots, builders and mechanics.

Thank you for the excellent comments, as always Dave. The result of this discussion is that I'm now sure that my plate doesn't meet the requirements in a couple of ways. I believe that why I got confused was because my first homebuilt has the "common" S.S. data plate that includes all of the detailed info mentioned, mounted inside the cockpit in plain sight. Then the exterior plate rule came out and I made & mounted the abbreviated version there. My understanding now is that if an airplane was manufactured before a certain date in 1988 that the abbreviated version (like I put on my Kitfox) then needed to be installed on the exterior of the plane. Sooo... I'm going to get the S.S. plate that I've had from Aircraft Spruce engraved with all the more detailed information and will install that in place of what I have now. Thanks again to all of you!

[jrevens]

OK, just to further clarify, I'm going to follow this advice from the EAA -
https://www.eaa.org/en/eaa/aviation-...ons/data-plate

So I'll make a new S.S. plate with my name (last name first, as registered), model , and serial number. That should do it - don't need anything more. Thanks again to all for getting me on the right path.